On this Feast of the Holy Name of Jesus it might be helpful simply to reflect on the name "Jesus, Joshua" It means "savior" but it has also another connotation which is important in our time - it means "spacious" "open" "a large garden" Where there is room to be free. This stands over against the Hebrew word for Egypt - Mitsryam which means a "restricted place"
tom in ga
Greetings All- This is a quote from the book "How You Can Be a Peacemaker" by Mary Evelyn Jegen, SND.
"There is perhaps no passage in the Gospels which stirs us more deeply than Saint Matthew's account of the Last Judgment. In the mysterious story of the king who will gather all the nations before him, separating good from bad as a shepherd separates sheep from goats, Jesus gave us his own vision of the meaning of human life. What matters in the end is love expressed in action for those in need. Jesus accepts as done to himself whatever we do to our neighbor.
Come, you whom my Father has blessed...For I was hungry and you gave me food... Go away from me.. For I was hungry and you never gave me food. (Matthew 25:34,35,41,42)
With good reason we cannot be indifferent to anyone who lacks the necessities of life. As our knowledge and love of God grow, so does our concern to respond as fully as we can to Jesus in what Mother Teresa of Calcutta calls 'his most distressing disquise.'"
Peace-- Lisa @ Duke Div
This scripture is a bit of a slap in the face to me. I am careful about my theology, striving to ensure that it is firmly rooted in the gospels. And yet Jesus sorts us out, not by our belief in 6-day creation, Virgin birth, or even his own messiah-ship; he cut the goats from the herd based on what they HAVEN'T DONE. You mean, you don't get any bonus points for reading your Bible(?!)
Grace and Peace
Joe in Tex
I stumbled on an article that has value for today's scripture. It is an interview with Cal Thomas and Ed Dobson about the role of Religious Right. In this, Thomas and Dobson speak candidly about how the Religious Right failed in its political involvement stemming from the '80's. Although their comments are addressed primarily to their own collegues within the Religious Right, I find them prophetic utterances for all religious leaders, regardless of politics or theology. "The so-called Religious Right are spiritual shoplifters. They want to move into the arena and steal things without paying the price. The price for the serious believer is to visit those in prison clothe the naked, feed the hungry, and care for widows and orphans. All of this is hard grunt work; you can't raise money on it--very few people want to send money in. They want to send money in to stop the "homosexual agenda," and they want to send money in to clean u television, eve though a lot of them are watching it." ----Cal Thomas The article continues on to link ministry to 'the least of these' as an essential prerequisite of any political or social change. The rest of the article is worth reading. I highly recommend it. "Seduced by Power" By Jim Wallis and "Hostage to an Illusion: An Interview with Cal Thomas and Ed Dobson." Sojourners, November/December 1999, pp 16-21. I think you can also access it at http://www.sojourners.com/soj9911/991110.html
DWR
I'm fairly new at preaching. What is concerning me about this week is how to avoid the trap of salvation by works and not by faith.Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks. JP
I meant to say salvation by grace not by works. JP
To JP and others concerned about Justification and this passage,
Today (October 31, 1999) in Augsburg Lutherans and Roman Catholics are signing a joint declaration which has at its heart the following:
``Together we confess: By grace alone, in faith in Christ's saving work and not because of any merit on our part, we are accepted by God and receive the Holy Spirit, who renews our hearts while equipping and calling us to good works.''
This has been a great struggle for Christians of all stripes. Myself a Catholic of 49 years never could quite understand what all the fuss was about because from the first catechism that I received we were imbued with the idea of grace that flows from the heart of God and that same Grace comes to us through faith. By grace our works become blest.
That being said, there are some serious questions that need to be answered. Can works affect Faith? By that I mean can our deeds and in some cases as spelled out in this text either increase the movement of the individual towards or against faith and accepting or rejecting grace?
In the past weeks we have heard Jesus respond to several groups, one of which are the Pharisees, who were possessors of "great faith' in the Law. Jesus excoriates these learned men as sticklers for carrying out the letter of the law with out any concern for the spirit of the law. They tie up heavy burdens for others to carry and yet won't lift a finger to ease the load.
We are creatures that are made up of the flesh and the spirit. We can not separate the two. Our physical actions (read works) must express the grace that is in our spirit. Works without grace does not grant salvation and no matter how "good" these works appear in the end they will be found a sham. On the other hand, true good works spring forth from a fountain of grace bearing testimony to the grace that lies at their foundation. I would call these works fruits of the Holy Spirit as expressed by Paul in Galatians 5: 19-25.
It appears that Jesus is saying the same thing in this text. Notice that neither the sheep or the goats recognized that they were serving of rejection Christ in their deeds. The sheep are just as clueless of having a Christ encounter and the goats. The sheep filled with the Spirit of God are carrying out the works to further the kingdom. The goats on the other hand work at furthering their own agendas.
Faith without works is dead-dead-dead! Works cannot get anyone salvation with out faith but faith without accompanying good works is false and is just as unsaving. For nearly 500 years Christians have been divide on this subject and if they had listened to each other instead of trying to be right we would have found out that we are not so different after all.
Sorry last post from Deke in Texas -- Pax et Bonem!
Date: 02 Nov 1999
Time: 02:57:15
JP, Welcome to the exciting world of proclaiming God's Word!
As for your question, perhaps this annology would help. The issue you address can be resolved by looking at motovation.
There are two good reasons why I will not go out and murder someone.
One, since it is against the law and I could be severly punished, I choose not to murder to avoid punishment. It is a motovation of fear, obligation, and duty.
Two, since I love my brothers and sisters in humanity, murder is impossible because of that love. I don't murder because my love makes such an unloving act impossible.
This is a trite example, but I think it illustrates the point. When a person does good things to the least of these in order to earn points for heaven, it is justification by works. I believe Jesus was saying that ours is a call to do to the least of these because we love him so much that we can do no other.
Note, the blessed who ministered to Christ were not aware of their good works. They were not keeping score or even being intentional at serving Christ. They were simply doing what the love in their heart naturally led them to do.
I sure hope this helps.
Peace,
DWR
Date: 07 Nov 1999
Time: 21:43:35
We are faced with a problem. Originally there was a kind of agnostic response, or an unknowing, which Jesus reveals in this parrable: what you did for the least you did for me!
Now we know, the cloud has been lifted, we know, in Mother Teresa's words, that Jesus is found in the distressing disquise of our neighbor in need.
What do we do with this knowledge, is it too heavy to bear, why don't we see in this parable the definition of what it means to belong to Christ?
If we live into the kingship of Christ, then what prevents us from loving the stranger.
tom in ga
Date: 10 Nov 1999
Time: 20:25:48
Just because Jesus tells a parable about a final judgement does not mean that Jesus is saying that this image represents reality. When philosopehrs argue certain issues they often will start with certain hypothetical situations and then expound upon that, trying to demonstrate a certain truth. Just because the paradigm of seperating the sheep and goats was popular in Jesus day, and that Jesus used this as the hypothetical basis for his argument, does not mean that Jesus is telling us that we have to think in these terms. In face, I believe Jesus is teaching us the opposite. Jesus is in efect, saying, "Ok you religious leaders love this image of judgement and seperation, try this on on for size". Then Jesus, as he usually does, turns the tables upside down. Ever notice how in the parable everyone is surprised to find which side on which they have been placed? Those who thought they were righteous were wrong. Those who did not seem so pius were the good ones. Here Jesus is arguing against using the paradigm of judgement. As soon as you think you are one of the righteous--you are one of the Pharasees. I think Jesus is saying "forget trying to be righteous and focus on seeing the image of God in your neighbor, every one of your neighbors." Manzel
Date: 12 Nov 1999
Time: 01:34:13
Greetings all I noticed that last week someone signed their contribution "Rev from Downunder". Now that's got me wondering... How many Aussies are out there reading this. I'd love to know. Sorry that this is a bit of a distraction from this weeks text but I'm curious.
G.P. from S.A. (South Australia)
Date: 12 Nov 1999
Time: 19:43:16
JP,
If you get a chance, try reading a wonderful book by Detrict Bonhoeffer called "The Cost of Discipleship." (Yes, it is still in print.) The issue of works versus faith, at least for Bonhoeffer, is not that difficult. For him, if you recognize that you sin, if you believe in Jesus as the Christ, the works must naturally follow. He makes the case, based on a sound Biblical backing, that yes, that we are saved by God's grace through our faith, but in that salvation we are changed. As a result, while sin will still creep into our lives, we are changed, we are different, we must live the full life that God has called us to be as Christians. Hence, our works. So this passage makes lots of sense! If we are truly Christian, we need to be living as such. No, we are not saved by our works, but a Chirstian is certainly called to be transformed by Christ and the results of that transformation can be seen in this weeks pericope. Best wishes on a powerful sermon.
PAX
Clint in Pittsburgh
Date: 13 Nov 1999
Time: 17:25:36
Last week, we had those who interpreted the parable in a manner that was the complete opposite of the more traditional and historic interpretations.
This week we have more expressions of what I'll call "opposite theology". And it makes me wonder...
If we were to apply this method of exegesis to the rest of Scripture, wouldn't it be neat...
Blessed are the rich in spirit...
Do not repent, for the kingdom of god is far away... (seems pretty appropriate today).
God so hated the world...
Man lives by bread alone...
Do not worship the Lord your God and do not serve him...
Put the Lord your God to the test...
The Spirit of the Lord is not on me, because he has not anointed me to preach good news to the poor. He has not sent me to proclaim freedom for the prisoners and recovery of sight for the blind, to release the oppressed, to proclaim the year of the Lord's favor...
Yep... seems like we could really have some fun with this sort of exegesis...
Then we could end our services with "Let us not go forth into the world, rejoicing in the power of the Spirit..."
Rick in Va
Date: 14 Nov 1999
Time: 01:54:08
To G.P. Hi I am a South Aussie. From Two Wells.
So that's one. Seriously though I know a few lay preachers who use this site.
mel
Date: 14 Nov 1999
Time: 03:18:22
Hi everyone, This is my first contribution to this site, although I've been reading it and thanking God for your thoughts for several months now.
I'm a lay preacher in Iowa -- and where I think I'm heading with this Gospel lesson is this: My mother always said, "You shouldn't have to be asked," and she was usually talking about keeping the house picked up. I'd say, "I'll help you if you'll just tell me what needs to be done." And her argument was that as a member of the family I didn't have to be asked, I should simply take responsibility -- for seeing that something needed to be done and for doing it.
I think Jesus is saying something like that here -- the sheep weren't "asked" to help the needy, they just did. They saw a need and they took care of it -- that is how we know they are "the righteous" because they took responsibility. The goats are those who either SAW the needs and ignored them, or didn't see the needs at all -- is that perhaps why Jesus was always saying "Let those with ears/eyes hear/see"?
Looking forward to reading all the other contributions for this week.
Jana
Date: 14 Nov 1999
Time: 04:05:16
This passage reminds me of the difference between faith and works, as well. I heard at seminary that Martin Luther once said, towards the end of his life, "If there be no works, methinks there is something wrong with the faith."
Rick in VA, it does seem some refuse to acknowledge the judgment that Jesus spoke of from time to time. The immediate response every time Jesus speaks of the "outer darkness" where "there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth" is the call that "this must be hyperbole!" I like your post about why not just turn around ALL of Jesus' teaching, as the post shows the absurdity of that hyperbole argument. Friends, when Jesus spoke of rejecting those who proudly cast aside the hungry, naked and imprisoned, He was speaking literally.
revup
Date: 14 Nov 1999
Time: 08:45:14
Off topic (sort of, but not quite) - to GP - I'm a Church of Scotland minister in Melbourne who values this site greatly, so you're not alone. To everybody else - most of you are from the US (I spend much time guessing the abbreviations of the States you come from) - which explains why it seems that 28 November is designated 'Thanksgiving' on this site, rather than the first Sunday in Advent. Am I right? And will we get contributions on Advbent 1, or does 'Thanksgiving' (not a liturgical festival as far as I'm aware) supercede that?!! John in Melbourne, Australia
Date: 14 Nov 1999
Time: 21:29:45
Using the RCL, November 21 is Christ the King up here. We usually end up celebrating Thanksgiving on Christ the King. November 28 is the First Sunday in Advent, the first day of the Christian New Year (Y2K?)
Reading this passage as we celebrate the Eternal Reign of Christ leads me to focus on his Lordship and his Kingdom. When I hear Jesus' pronouncements in the parable it reminds me of how he described kingdom principles throughout Matthew. (eg. Beatitudes and all of chs. 5- 7) In this parable Jesus demonstrates that there are already those who are living in the kingdom and those who are not. There are those who see the face of God in the least, last and lost and respond with grace.
I understand the desire to explicate this in order to figure out what we need to do to avoid being cast out. But I don't think that Jesus intends for us to simply figure out how to avoid eternal judgement. That would only serve a human bent to figure out the minimum requirements and make them. Jesus tells us what it might look like if we lived in his kingdom. He doesn't give us "Rules and Regulations." He tells us that the rules that were already written were good enough. He is calling us to live a life that is beyond the scope of the rules. We seem to want to take that call and turn it into another set of rules.
Perhaps on the day that we celebrate Christ's reign, we can focus on what the Kingdom of Heaven is.
RevMommy
PS. Does is seem to anyone else that much of what we call theology is really anthropological?
Date: 14 Nov 1999
Time: 21:56:02
Jana, your Mom certainly understood this Gospel lesson! Your use of the house-cleaning analogy works neatly. If we say, "I love a clean house!" but never pick up, who would believe us? If we say, "I love Christ!" but do not tend His sheep, who will believe us? In John 21:15-17 over and over when Jesus asks Peter if he loves Him and Peter says yes, Jesus directs him to care for His sheep. Loving Christ is a concrete ACTION not an abstract IDEA.
The Gospel lessons last week and this week are VERY clear. Not trying is not an option. Being inactive is NOT neutral. It is evil. If that gets our goat, so be it! DL in ME
Date: 15 Nov 1999
Time: 07:27:26
15-11-99 5.20pm Hi G.P from S.A. I'm Rev from down under. Maryborough, Quuensland to be exact. I really get a lot of inspiration from this site. I've probably been reading it only for a month!? I'm an Anglican female priest who loves God's challenging Word. And who tries to bring the Word alive in my life and hoepfully in others lives. This week Im not sure what I'm going to preach about but I've found what has been written so far very valuable. Rev from Down Under.
Date: 15 Nov 1999
Time: 15:25:27
Hello Sheep,
We are the Sheep of God's pasture. Sheepishly, we respond to God's grace by loving our neighbor. We are rewarded for our response not for works for works sake. Our motivation is not looking for Jesus but in expressing our love for God to the least of these.
The common understanding of sheepishly is shy, God's sheep are bold, courageous, caring, and loving in selfless way!
Bruce in WI
Date: 15 Nov 1999
Time: 15:41:54
Seems to me that each of us is a mixture----part sheep, part goat.
How many times have I passed by a homeless person and not offered food? More than I can count.
How many times have I eaten a lavish Thanksgiving feast while God's children in my own county are hungry? At least 47!
How often have I visited those who are sick? Also a lot!
Maybe God is not keeping a score card. Maybe learning to see Jesus in the least of these is an ongoing process for many of us. And, just maybe, His grace is sufficient.
God's Peace, CF
Date: 15 Nov 1999
Time: 19:41:30
Interesting that no-one has picked up on the idea that the nations represented the Gentiles. Was this idea of judgement only for the Gentiles or for all people? Also it is interesting that Jesus is called the Son of Man at the beginning of the passage then calls Himself, King later on.
Date: 15 Nov 1999
Time: 20:32:31
Thanks everybody, for your wonderful reflections. This is my very first time searching the Web for sermon ideas or lectionary reflections, and it's so great to feel connected to all of you this way.
Rev. Nina, Maryland USA
Date: 15 Nov 1999
Time: 20:51:20
Joe in Texas- yet Jesus sorts us out, not by our belief in 6-day creation, Virgin birth, or even his own messiah-ship; he cut the goats from the herd based on what they HAVEN'T DONE. You mean, you don't get any bonus points for reading your Bible(?!)
Joe... well Joe, it depends on the version!
donhoff, elmira
Date: 15 Nov 1999
Time: 20:56:13
JP from SA
<<Now that's got me wondering... How many Aussies are out there reading this. I'd love to know.>>
Now if you REALLY want to know... place your email address and have them all send the response directly to you...more effecient than their all writing this page and saying "G'day mate".
donhoff, elmira
Date: 15 Nov 1999
Time: 20:56:33
JP from SA
<<Now that's got me wondering... How many Aussies are out there reading this. I'd love to know.>>
Now if you REALLY want to know... place your email address and have them all send the response directly to you...more effecient than their all writing this page and saying "G'day mate".
donhoff, elmira
Date: 15 Nov 1999
Time: 21:57:59
Can someone help me locate the story about the cobbler who dreamed that Christ would visit him the next day, so he rose early, cleaned his house...a knock on the door revealed a shoeless child, etc, etc. PDS in Chatt
Date: 15 Nov 1999
Time: 22:48:51
Dear RevMommy, It's Christ the King or at least the reign of Christ here too. The two names give a really different meaning to this Sunday don't they. Christ's Kingship is tied in so deeply with our servanthood, and Christs. My anthropology is not good, and I'm a long way from a good library so I have some questions about the and the goats from memory we know that shepherds looked after both the sheep and the goats, the goats were not neglected. Also I think from I remember from studying agriculture the sheep and the goats of the region would have looked remarkadly alike Is it a point that only a shepherd would be able to seperate the sheep and the goats Therefore we need to remember that just as Christ the King came as a servant, those we think the goats could be the sheep and visa versa. this then continues along with last weeks discussion about the reign being possible on earth, but found in unexpected places such as the outer darkness
By the way, I've really enjoyed this site, although I haven't responded before. It's great to see so many different responses to the readings
Sarah in NSW (Aus)
Date: 15 Nov 1999
Time: 23:46:20
To PDS in Chatt;
I found this while surfing sermon sites. Hope this is what you are looking for. Steve in Ohio
Date: 15 Nov 1999
Time: 23:59:47
To PDS in Chatt; When I tried to paste in the contribution box it wouldn't work. Sorry. Steve in Ohio
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 01:39:38
PDS in Chatt: I think I have the book - if you still need it, email me at kculp@awod.com
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 02:23:14
I have been following a theme for the past 3 weeks which began with the wise and foolish virgins. In that passage this generation in which we live is "waiting" in anticipation for the future. The whole of our life is waiting. Waiting for the future. The nature of love itself is often in the form of waiting. For the next event, or opportunity. Just like the loving Father waiting for the prodigal son to return. Almighty God waiting for mankind to repent and rethink the way in which we act. In this waiting Life/Love can be squandered if we fall into the trap of being frightened to act, or become apathetic and drowsy with waiting. From my perspective, Matthew is wanting Christians to see that the coming of Christ, whenever that may be, means that we can not become complacent, but that we are to be actively living out the unconditional, uncontrolling love which Christ depicted in his earthly life. God therefore asks us to invest the talent (a proportion of God's own Spirit given to us in Baptism) for His glory. So the last two weeks for me have been about "being ready", and "what are some of the dangers to readiness". For me, this weeks passage indicates the nature of what that "active" waiting, is. It details how simple and yet demanding love is. Often we do not realise, that the simple little impulsive things that we do, are for more meaningful than the large organised events. In another passage of scripture, Paul suggests that living the life of Christ is this, "They are to do good, to be rich in good works, generous, and ready to share, thus storing up for themselves the treasure of a good foundation for the future, so that they may take hold of the life that really is life." 1 Tim 6:18.
Certainly this passage can be seen in eschatological (end-time) terms, but I think it provides us with far more practical evidence of the nature of living the Christian life, everyday. If we do these things we have invested the talent (proportion) given to us, and we have kept our lamp trimmed. We are ready.
These are my humble thoughts.
KGB in Aussie. (Home of the Rugby World Cup)
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 04:53:09
To all our brothers and sisters "down under"- Greetings from "up over" in the U.S.A.. How smug we are, bandying about our abreviations, expecting everyone knows! Sorry. How goatly. I'll try to be more sheepish. Tom in Murfreesboro, Tennessee, U.S.A. Deke in Texas- Last week you mentioned "Blue Christmas".About the same time, I read an account of some one preaching on the song "I'll Be Home For Christmas" about Advent being a time of longing for Home. Between the two of you, I think I've found a series to preach thru Advent. I'm also doing "White Christmas" and still looking for a fourth Sunday song. For "Blue Christmas" my point will be-The bad news is Death invades the times we plan to be Jolly. But the good news is God invades the days Death plans to ruin with His own life-giving being! I will tell my own story of how we buried our 3 year old daughter on Christmas Eve afternoon and how we were ministered to by our church's presence, in numbers that staggered the mind of our funeral director. The church's LIFE denied Death the victory. Hope this helps. Tom in Tn.,U.S.A.
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 05:26:53
We should note that goats were associated with the diabolical.
We should also note that Matthew consistently uses "all the nations" to refer to the peoples to whom the Apostles are to go and make disciples. The judgment can then be rendered not on how we treat a homeless person, but on how we treat a missionary. That means it is a stretch to use this parable to suport feeding the hungry of the world with bread for the body, etc. We who are in need of the saving word should hunger not for bread for our bodies, but for the bread of life. We will be judged then on how we treat those who come to us in the name of the Lord.
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 13:42:05
Hi all, I will not be preaching on this Sunday but I have to do an oral manuscript for college. When I was looking at this I thought about what Jesus said ie 'my sheep know my voice' etc so what is/does Jesus say that might be appropriate to look at maybe the 2 commandments he gave us. Or what about the themes of following like in Mark's Gospel. I was also reading somewhere that the goats were far more destructive to the vegetaion than sheep and also that even though they would travel as part of the herd of sheep they, the goats, kept togehter, slept togehter and never really integrated as part of the sheep herd. I find Ray Stedmans sermon's a real help- you can find him and many more preachers by searching for the Penninsula Bible Church on your web browser.
mel South Oz.
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 13:53:16
Once upon a time in one of the rural UMC's I had the priviledge to serve, a young vacation bible school student sang for the closing worship service: "Jesus loves me this I know for Ma Mabel told me so"! When I read and meditate on this scripture from time to time, I gain a fresh appreciation for the interrelation or dynamics between personal holiness and soccial holiness. Just as "Ma Mabel", and not just the Bible, told Megan that "Jesus loves me", so almost for as long as DPS has been on line "Nail-Bende" has shared such insightful revelations about the connection of personal holiness and social holiness. I don't believe I ever read and meditated on one of his stories that I did not think of this scripture. Nail-Bender thank you for your contributions to DPS family and for your vision of the suffering servant of the sacred covenant PaideiaSCO in north ga mts.
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 15:14:03
PaideiaSCO: We are separated very far theologically, but I agree 100% about how this scripture shows the close (actually intimate) connection between social holiness and social holiness. This text is classic for missionaries. Like you, I treasure Nail-Bender's ability to show examples of social holiness. Got any this week, Nail-Bender? revup
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 15:14:26
For PDS in Chatt (from crystal)
The Cobbler and His Guest by Leo Tolstoy
There once lived in the city of Marseilles an old shoemaker, loved and honored by his neighbors, who affectionately called him "Father Martin"
One Christmas Eve, as he sat alone in his little shop reading of the visit of the Wise Men to the infant Jesus, and of the gifts they brought, he said to himself. "If tomorrow were the first Christmas, and if Jesus were to be born in Marseilles this night, I know what I would give Him!" He rose from his stool and took from a shelf overhead two tiny shoes of softest snow- white leather, with bright silver buckles. "I would give Him those, my finest work."
Replacing the shoes, he blew out the candle and retired to rest. Hardly had he closed his eyes, it seemed, when he heard a voice call his name..."Martin! Martin!"
Intuitively he felt a presence. Then the voice spoke again..."Martin, you have wished to see Me. Tomorrow I shall pass by your window. If you see Me, and bid Me enter, I shall be your guest at your table."
Father Martin did not sleep that night for joy. And before it was yet dawn he rose and swept and tidied up his little shop. He spread fresh sand upon the floor, and wreathed green boughs of fir along the rafters. On the spotless linen-covered table he placed a loaf of white bread, a jar of honey, and a pitcher of milk, and over the fire he hung a pot of tea. Then he took up his patient vigil at the window.
Presently he saw an old street-sweeper pass by, blowing upon his thin, gnarled hands to warm them. "Poor fellow, he must be half frozen," thought Martin. Opening the door he called out to him, "Come in, my friend, and warm, and drink a cup of hot tea." And the man gratefully accepted the invitation.
An hour passed, and Martin saw a young, miserably clothed women carrying a baby. She paused wearily to rest in the shelter of his doorway. The heart of the old cobbler was touched. Quickly he flung open the door.
"Come in and warm while you rest," he said to her. "You do not look well," he remarked.
"I am going to the hospital. I hope they will take me in, and my baby boy," she explained. "My husband is at sea, and I am ill, without a soul."
"Poor child!" cried Father Martin. "You must eat something while you are getting warm. No, Then let me give a cup of milk to the little one. Ah! What a bright, pretty fellow he is! Why, you have put no shoes on him!"
"I have no shoes for him," sighed the mother sadly. "Then he shall have this lovely pair I finished yesterday." And Father Martin took down from the shelf the soft little snow-white shoes he had admired the evening before. He slipped them on the child's feet...they fit perfectly. And shortly the poor young mother left, two shoes in her hand and tearful with gratitude.
And Father Martin resumed his post at the window. Hour after hour went by, and although many people passed his window, and many needy souls shared his hospitality, the expected Guest did not appear.
"It was only a dream," he sighed, with a heavy heart. "I did not believe; but he has not come."
Suddenly, so it seemed to his weary eyes, the room was flooded with a strange light. And to the cobbler's astonished vision there appeared before him, one by one, the poor street-sweeper, the sick mother and her child, and all the people whom he had aided during the day. And each smiled at him and said. "Have you not seen me? Did I not sit at your table?" Then they vanished.
At last, out of the silence, Father Martin heard again the gentle voice repeating the old familiar words. "Whosoever shall receive one such in My name, receiveth Me...for I was an hungered, and ye gave Me meat; I was athirst, and ye gave Me drink; I was a stranger, and ye took Me in...verily I say unto you, inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these, ye have done it unto Me."
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 15:25:45
Frank/DPS staff: Please note typo at beginning of scripture lesson, it says Mt 25:31-26 not 46.
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 15:32:56
I see many other first-time contributors this week, so I will count myself among them. Thanks to the many who have fed me during my times of lurking.
Something I read this week pointed out that this text is not about being a humanitarian, it's about Christology. So it's not about trying to decide whether we are a sheep or a goat (or trying to decide which "Mrs. Jones" is, which is what we really want to do), it's about Jesus. It's about this crazy upside down King of the Universe who feeds the hungry, etc. and then infuses the rest of us with the Holy Spirit to make us into the Body of Christ in order that we can keep right on doing the same. Especially for Christ the King Sunday, that seems to be a much more useful approach than chiding people for not contributing to the soup kitchen.
RevLauren, LA Delta
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 16:50:04
I have yet to post a comment on this site, but am intrigued by this passage. It is one that continually keeps me centered and motivated in ministry. So many things in our faith tend to be related to the abstract. General terms of love and forgiveness are thrown around often. It is refreshing to have a list in front of us. What are we supposed to do? It is very clear: feed, visit, clothe, etc. This is a tangible list. Jesus says, "whenever you did it for the least of these". I often hear about people hesitating to help with food, money, whatever because they have been taken advantage of in the past. Christ helps us overcome that barrier. It doesn't say, whenever you did it for someone who you deemed worthy. It says "the least of these". Judgment is reserved for God. Another possible angle with this is that the beginning of the passage starts out, "when all the nations are gathered before him". Nations implies a corporate responsibility. We live in the wealthiest country in the world and our neighbors in Mexico struggle terribly. Do we ever read this passage through a communal lens? I've always heard of it as a very individualized passage. But, I feel like the word nations is included to hold governmental structures that oppress and refuse to visit, feed and clothe responsible. Anyway, I hope that might give someone some direction. I have wrestled with this passage often.
Mike, TEXAS
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 17:15:24
To the one who asked about the anthropological significance of the sheep and the goats.....if memory served me correctly, the goats were not nearly so valued as an animal as the sheep. The goats were more destructive to vegetation as it was mentioned and the sheep were velued for so much...as sacrificial animals, food, for their wool etc. However, I think too that we need to enphasize that this IS Christ the King Sunday. Why> Because so often we look at Jesus as "Gentle Jesus , meek and Mild" which is a metaphor I love and use a lot but we also need to hear that Jesus has the kingly authority to judge! This is an accountability passage and we so often judge one another on whether we are sheep or goats but guess what? Only God and God's Son can judge and that puts a whole new spin on our self righteous, self serving attitudes. It also frees us to know that we don't have to JUDGE (thank God!)...it's not our place and GOd has that handled!! This should help us all!!!! Blessings-Preacher Woman in Vermont
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 17:54:55
Thanks, RevLauren, LA Delta. I do plan to start with Christ and the needed transformation of ourselves so we are not goats, and then go on to say what sheep should act and look like. (If we act like a goat and think like a goat, we are goats calling ourselves sheep.) After we are transformed we can transfuse Christ into others so they are healed spiritually PLUS physically, emotionally and socially.
We recently threw out the rules of our church food pantry and made a new one, "If you are in need, come and take what you need." At our recent Finance Committee meeting someone asked, "I wonder if anyone is taking advantage of us?" The chairperson, (a FORMER "tightwad" afaid to give anything away), said, "It is not for us to judge, we will leave that to God. We just have to be sure we give to all of those who are in need. That's what Jesus would do." Yes, God is working around here! We are serving 4 to 5 times as many people now, but the donated food and money comes in like the "loaves and fishes."
I am finding that when we preach Christ with both a spiritual and social Gospel message, God can accomplish much. I feel this passage combines those two aspects of the Gospel as Jesus taught it. Faith without works is impossible (see Luther quote above) but works without faith is like fighting the enemy without your best weapon, God's Holy Spirit. I hope no one looks over either aspect when preaching the text. revup
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 18:52:52
Good stuff so far.
Since this is Christ the King Sunday, I will preach about how we are to behave when our king seems to be absent.
Like KGB in Aussie, I see this passage as the culmination of a set of three parables about how we are to behave in the "absence" of our master. As in the parables of the bridesmaids and the talents, the master returns on the day of reckoning. He invites the faithful to share in his joy, and the lazy he casts into the outer darkness.
Notice that the damning trait in all three stories is laziness. Of course, unfaithfulness or egocentrism may be the root cause of this flaw, but all three stories specifically point to laziness.
I hope many of you are also using the Ezekiel passage in your readings. It too is about how we respond while the master is away. In this case, God returns and assumes the role of the good shepherd and passes judgment on those sheep who tried to pretend they were shepherds and abused the weaker sheep.
This weeks passage distinguishes itself from the others because we learn that the absentee master really isn't absent after all. The king is already in our midst.
there are many stories about the absent king returning to over throw the tyrant and restoring order. Robin Hood is my favorite. While King Richard is captured on one of the crusades, his brother Prince John assumes the throne and levies enormous taxes on the people. Robin Hood becomes an outlaw so he can serve the poor and remain faithful to Richard. After Richard reclaimed the throne, he disguised himself as a friar to pay Robin a visit in cognito. Convinced that Robin was a good, loyal man, Richard revealed himself and offered Robin and his men pardons, offering them official positions in the royal service.
Sorry about the lengthy submission. DSS
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 19:51:34
Sorry, for this mishmash - there are a lot of ideas out there this week. We will be celebrating Christ the King on Sunday a.m. - a Community Thanksgiving Service on Sunday p.m. and 1 Advent on the 28th. For a song for the 4th Sunday of Advent how about "We need A Little Christmas - Right this very minute" - From the musical Mame. To DL in ME - I loved the pun about not serving not being an option...and if that gets out goat...In my first parish the sheep farmers usually kept a few goats (or even Lama's) to keep the preditors away. If you have looked at the Ezekiel text - I would be interested in comments. The text has God seperating the fat sheep from the skinny ones. I have enjoyed seeing where everyone is from. mehrke in South Dakota USA
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 21:02:06
I agree that the real "meat" of this passage is how the "nations" received the people of God. Yet, I also wonder if there isn't some aspect of inspecting how the "nations" treated each other.
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 21:04:31
Not long ago, on T.V. there was a commentary about a Catholic sister who has worked in Calcutta for a very long time.
This sister began her work as a teacher in a school for the priveleged of Calcutta. Over time, she became the Head Mistress. Like Mother Theresa she was concerned about people living in Calcutta poverty. After she was given the responsibility of Head Mistress, she convinced the patrons of the school to offer scholarships to children from the streets. At first there was enormous resistence, but the sister was patient. Eventually, she was able to bring a few poor children into the school. Over the years, the number of scholarship children has significantly increased. Enough time has passed for success stories to grow. The school has become very different. A lot of barriers have been lifted in that school. All of the childrens' lives have been enhanced, not just the lives of the street children. I believe that there was the presence of Christ in the privileged children, too, who had been alienated from a significant number of their sisters and brothers in Calcutta. The school began to break-down the alienation as well as give more children the opportunity of education.
The reason I mention this story is because I am reminded of the old saying... " Give someone fish to eat today and they will be hungry tomorrow. Teach someone to fish and they don't have to be hungry tomorrow. "
I believe that when persons with resources feed,visit, cloth and offer short-term hospitality to those without resources, we are, only, touching immediate needs... which very quickly need more attention. We are not addressing the reasons why people might be hungry, naked, sick or lonely.
I remember a quote by Dom Helder Camera...." When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a communist. "
How would someone without financial means to meet their basic, physical needs hear this text?
Would they expect someone to give them short term resourses? Would this text help them recognize the presence of Christ in their lives? Would they look for someone with less resources than themselves as a place to share? ...Would they just extend the rungs of the ladder down a few more rungs? Would they spiritualize the needs so that they would include more than material needs to hunger, thirst, nakedness and lonliness? Would this enable everyone reading the scripture to be able to see Christ in persons they were alienated from?
I read an old sermon by John Wesley that I got off the internet, I can't remember where, but it is # 98. He wrote:
" One great reason why the rich, in general, have so little sympathy for the poor, is, because they so seldom visit them. Hence it is, that, according to the common observation, one part of the world does not know what the other suffers. "
Kairos
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 21:55:36
Kairos,
You have sparked some real thinking in me. I have been wrestling with the expectation we have for the results of this passage. We automatically think of a future reward, and we lump all persons as the same. The hungry, sick and imprisoned are not considered in the equation with the "Son of Man" and the nations. (Please realize, Kairos, this is not a critique of what you have written; your valuable comments helped my thinking). I think the passage is similar to Jesus episode with the rich young ruler. Jesus has compassion, and says the man lacked one thing, give all he had to the poor and follow him. To me, the reward, and the entering into the kingdom happens when we participate with the poor and needy. As we increase in our sincerity and non judgemental activities, they become persons with names, and we learn and participate in lives together. Sometimes those who benefit most from those who have not, because of the relationship. We are blessed. Jesus mirrored such when he said of the Canaanite woman, ""Woman, great is your faith! Let it be done for you as you wish." From a human standpoint, he showed the benefit one receives when participating and/or dialoging with another. I am going to focus on the Ezekiel passage on this Christ the King Sunday. The eleventh verse of chapter 34 says, "For thus says the Lord GOD: I myself will search for my sheep, and will seek them out". I'd rather meditate with the congregation on our encounter with this "King" in our lives. God has truly been engaging us, as we deal with the homeless issue in our community. It has been a learning, and a blessing. It has come from God, and has made us a stronger congregation. The sermon title is "King: revisited."
Shalom
Pasthersyl
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 22:25:59
Did the order of the comments get disarranged?
They are confusing....they moved from this week backward into other weeks on my screen?????
Date: 16 Nov 1999
Time: 22:47:22
It does seem like recent gospel readings give teeth to the old sins of omission. Last week's very complimentary lesson from the Hebrew scriptures seemed to draw the same conclusion. Who was God searching out and punishing? Those who "rest complacently on their dregs". And what is one implication of "inactivity" on our part? "...the Lord will not do good, nor will he do harm." (Zeph 1:12). In other words, (our) inactivity asserts that God too is uninvolved, irrelevant, inactive. Rather, for we who are justified by God's grace (not what these recent texts are about, in my mind) the response (as others have said), is the deeds of love and mercy. Naturally, we don't ascribe to this Matthean judgment more weight than the whole of Christ's will revealed inside and outside the written word... I don't believe Jesus is teaching that the only criteria of the Christian life is service to others (elsewhere we learn about the value of fellowship and of course, worship, for example), but surely the walk of faith yeilds such works as the shepherd/Lamb (see "The REvelation to John"!)/king requires. Hang in there with these tough judgment texts. WIth Advent's 2nd coming and the end of the 1990's, our prophetic sense will need to preach hope, salvation and victory too! Peter in CA
Date: 17 Nov 1999
Time: 07:07:33
As to points and issues of justification and salvation by works. I'm reminded in my reading that Matthew's community is not Paul's. In other words, where Paul (most of the time) is still writing/preaching kerygma, the stuff of faith and belief, Matthew is dealing with believers and their behavior. Matthew presupposes his audience are already "believers". The issue then is what are we to do while we wait for the return of Christ. The answer, as a friend reminded me, "treat the poorest, most wretched, naked, hungry and imprisoned, like family. In other words, join them.
I think our usual response is to try to get them to join us. But I think the idea is be in solidarity, join them, become one of them. Mother Theresa is sighted here a few times, so I'll stick with her (though Oscar Romero and others would be fine examples) she didn't send a check, she didn't set up a clinic in the suburbs and bus the lepers to her. She moved in, set up camp, (sort of Emmanuel-esque).
My difficutly is that I'm not sure I'm prepared to move in. I confess it would be easy to preach a sermon to "them - the congregation" to go and become one, but when it comes down to it, I don't even like to ride the bus.
Awhile back, I read an article about a family in Danville, Kentucky that invited a man named Nate Sims to live with them. They were white. He was black. He was also spent 20 years in prison as a convicted sex offender. They lived in $150K house in a nice suburb. His room was across the hall from their children's playroom.
The couple, Mark and Tammy LaPalme explained they wer "baby Christians" out to test their newfoud, born again faith.
To make a long story...Sims was run out by the neighbors, the LaPalme's were ostracized and treated as "crazy" for letting Sims near their kids.
What strikes me in the story is that solidarity means crossing the line to the other side. It often means leaving the goats to side with the sheep, or to side with the least.
Late night ramblings,
Kelly on the WA sound
Date: 17 Nov 1999
Time: 13:31:20
Kelly on WA sound: I am curious about your statement: "Matthew presupposes his audience are already 'believers'". My background and training said Matthew was writing to the Jewish people. He was trying to convince them Jesus was the Messiah through Old Testament quotes supposedly fulfilled by Christ. For one, Barclay states, "First and foremost, Matthew is the Gospel which is written for the Jews. It was written by a Jew in order to convince Jews." (Gospel of Matthew Vol. 1, page 5) Anyone know of other commentators who say Mt. was writing primarily to believers? It does make a difference in this case, as Kelly stated. Of course, Paul does say he is the Apopstle to the gentiles. revup
Date: 17 Nov 1999
Time: 14:19:50
Anyone notice the Son of Man already knew his flock. They were blessed before they did a single act. The fact that we are known, makes us different. It is being known by Jesus that allows us to see Him as the least. Anyone can do good works in the world. What matters is why we do them, for whom we do them. The fact that we are already blessed, already sheep, sheep that know our masters voice – this is what allows us to do good works.
The relationship we have with Christ, not the good works, makes us distinguishable as sheep. Feeding Him, clothing Him, Seeing Him as the least – this is what it means to follow Him. Grace shines through our works, only because we first received that Grace. It is easy, the hard part is knowing (having faith) that you are worth it -- He died for you – His grace is already received – your discipleship has been carved out – so go forth rejoicing in the power of that.
Fr. Sully
Date: 17 Nov 1999
Time: 14:31:21
To PDS in Chatt: I found the story you are looking for in "Stories for Telling" by William R. White. He adapts the original Tolstoy story (thanks for supplying that, Crystal) very nicely.
I'm still hashing out a direction for my preaching this Sunday. Possible foci are 1) how claiming Christ as King does not mean serving him so much as it means manifesting him, and 2) using psalm 95 for input, how our relationship with our King is shaped by our worship and praise made concrete in our relationships of compassion and service to others.
It seems that Jesus asks no small thing from us -- to live our lives as he would, fearlessly embracing the poor, the deprived, the outcast and bringing the love of God to them (not waiting for them to come looking for it). Am I prepared to do this? Is any one of us?
Jim in the Blue Ridge
Date: 17 Nov 1999
Time: 15:22:11
Is this text only calling those of us with resources to feed, cloth and offer hospitality to those without resourses?
Is social broken-ness only noticed when people lack the BASIC necessities of life? People without basic necessities are the only social segment labled the " least " ?
Doesn't Christ, also, live in all of us whose basic necessities of life overflow in abundance, but lay fallow within our limited boundaries? Doesn't that make us one of the " least " in God's Kingdom?
...the old saying " Poor little rich kid "
Kairos
Date: 17 Nov 1999
Time: 16:00:46
Fr. Sully,
Excellent words. Reasons why it is so important that the Church's primary focus be the proclamation of the gospel. How futile are good works without the saving knowledge of God's grace in Christ Jesus? How much more productive and fruitful would the Church be if we were motivated by that knowledge rather than some vain self-centered desire to be seen as 'good'?
Preach it brother, preach the Word.
Rick in Va
Date: 17 Nov 1999
Time: 16:43:53
Related to Matt's audience. I agree that he was trying to convince a Jewish audience, but it seems clear that most of the time he is using the Jewish people as a straw man to convince believers how to act and behave. See the recent readings and allegories where the Jewish people and the leaders are the ones who "kill the son, stone the servants, etc." Can we really believe that this was an effort to convince Jewish non-believers to believe? It appears more as a reminder to those already believing (Jewish or not), don't reject the stone, don't behave the same way, don't forget now that you've been grafted on.
Remember, the gospels are written well after the communities are established, they seemed to serve less as kerygma at the time than they do now (absolutely important in our apathetic culture, that needs kerygma).
Also, isn't Matthew the last of the Synoptics written, I'll have to check that against Luke, I don't remember.
Good conversation,
Kelly
Date: 17 Nov 1999
Time: 18:55:53
To Kelly and others,
Interesting discussion on the author's purpose and audience for the gospel as a whole in relation to this week's text. Here is an interesting quote on point that I found in the introduction to Matthew in the New Interpreter's Bible:
"The Jewish elements in the Gospel do not mean that it was written for the Jews in the sense that it was directed to Jewish outsiders to convince them that Jesus is the Messiah. Matthew wrote his Gospel for members of his own community to instruct them in their own faith and to clarify it over against misunderstandings, not as an evangelistic or apologetic writing directed to outsiders."
I would venture to say that all four gospels act in this way and thus should be read first from the point of view of the believer and then second to the non-believer.
Jeff in AR
Date: 17 Nov 1999
Time: 19:03:28
Just an idea (taken from Whole People of God resources)... our youth group is rewriting the Ezekiel passage tonight (i.e., translating so that little children can understand it more clearly). Then one of the kids will read the translated version as the OT lesson at the family service (lots in kids), in costume, dressed as a shepherd or prophet. Maybe he/she will even write and read it on a "scroll". Should be fun!
Question: I'm preaching on Matthew: does anyone have an idea for a short dramas/skit the kids can perform? I'm at Dingwoman1@aol.com
Blessings from Edinburgh, Dingwoman
Date: 17 Nov 1999
Time: 19:55:15
Re the faith/works debate/dialogue: I just quickly skimmed the hymns by John Greenleaf Whittier found in the 1958 Pilgrim Hymnal. For those of you whose hymnals include some of Whittier's work, it's worth a quick perusal.
Two examples: (vs. 1) "Within the maddening maze of things/When tossed by storm and flood/To one fixed trust my spirit clings/I know that God is good! (vs 2) "No offering of my own I have/Nor works my faith to prove/I can but give the gifts he gave/And plead his love for love."
(With recognition of non-inclusive language) "O brother man, fold to thy heart thy brother/Where pity dwells, the peace of God is there/To worship rightly is to love each other/Each smile a hymn, each kindly deed a prayer."
In my community, I am impressed/inspired by those folks who do good to others, not out of some vain, self-centered desire to justify themselves or to make themselves look good, but simply because they know that doing good is a good and right and fitting thing to do.
Doug in Riverside
Date: 17 Nov 1999
Time: 20:42:23
Dear Revmommy and Sarah,
Thanks. This is my first visit to this sight. I shall be focusing on "Christ the King" this Sunday. Christ as Son of the Father and the Messiah King; Christ as Judge and executer of the estate; Christ as "one of the least of these." It sounds to me like most everyone(including most of the members of my church) is hung up on trying to figure out if they are a sheep or a goat. Point: only Jesus knows for sure - even the sheep and goats didn't know (mixed community?) This reminds me of a popular song a few years ago, "What if God were one of us . . . just a stranger on the bus trying to make his way home." I do have to wonder what the anthropological reason was for separating the sheep from the goats. I appreciate the fact that goats and sheep were grazed together and looked very much alike (important point in relation to this text), but what were the practical reasons for separating them? Anyone got any ideas? I also appreciated the discussion of Matthew's intended audience. What about Jesus' audience in this pericope? Was it not the disciples who had gathered on the Mount of Olives with Jesus to question him about his kingdom and the "end of the age?" Did not these disciples appear to be a whole flock of sheep when really there was a goat in their midst whom no one recognized - Judas? Just thought this might stir a few more thoughts.
Camille in NC
Date: 17 Nov 1999
Time: 21:19:11
To Clint in Pitts., et al: Bonhoeffer gave us the great expression: "Grace may be free, but it is not cheap." Jesus became Christ, the King, by the most expensive route. Any confession or expression of faith that is void of the fruit of the Spirit cheapens grace inexcusably.
On the topic of "social holiness" this: Years ago while serving in a much different theological camp than I prersently serve I was the guest preacher in what is still known as a "Revival". The pastor of the church and I were out on visitation assignments in the afternoon. We visited a single mother of two in a very poor, little house. Poverty reeked out of every wall. The children were dressed in the scantiest of clothing, and very tattered, and dirty. In talking with the mother we learned that the cupboards were empty, and all the food in the house was a half loaf of bread, and a can of soup. And, there was no money for anything. The pastor turned from conversation about those necessities, and began his "witness" to her, walking her down the "plan of salvation", and pressing her for her decision to trust Christ as her Savior. When we were finished there, and on our way back to the church, I asked if it would would be really practical to share with the congregation in the service that night the plight of this family, and take a collection to help relieve their sufferings. The pastor shrugged my question off as irrelevant, saying: "The greatest thing that we could do for the woman we had done in the witness to Jesus." I take that to mean: "She can starve to death. But, when she does her saved soul will be in heaven, and I'll have another notch in my handle (star in my crown)." Frankly, I think Jesus Christ was left hungry, naked, and ill-housed!! Grace is not cheap, nor to be cheapened.
Dan in Ohio
Date: 17 Nov 1999
Time: 22:54:01
Re the separation of sheep and goats (Jeremias, "The Parables of Jesus," p. 206): "In Palestine mixed flocks are customary; in the evening the shepherd separatesthe sheep from the goats, since the goats need to be kept warm at night, for cold harms them, while the sheep prefer open air at night."
Pheme Perkins, "Hearing the Parables of Jesus," p. 162: "Whether or not a person has aided 'one of the least' will be as easy to determine as it is to teach a child to tell sheep and goats apart. Like the vineyard workers, there is no need in this picture of things for a detailed system of reward. The sheep are not sorted into separate classes according to the number of such people helped. Even motivation is not required. A person does not have to recognize Christ/God in the person [in need. 'When did we see thee...']. Perhaps the sheep acted as they did because they had listened to Moses and the prophets,...or perhaps they acted simply out of compassion--like the Samaritan. In either case, the judgment is the same."
Doug in Riverside
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 01:34:49
GP
I'm one.
MD from South Australia
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 03:45:20
Oh Dear Crystal,
Thank you for Tolstoy.
JC in Philly
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 04:00:09
When this topic comes up, I always think of an event that happened when my son (now 27) was just about 2 years old. I will probably tell this story Sunday.
We had gone for a drive out by the lake when we saw "Raggedy Ann". "Raggedy Ann" was the name we called the old black woman who roamed about our small town, picking through the garbage for her food and supplies. She was always dressed in layers of raggedy clothing, and she carried a crude walking stick to scare off the dogs and ornery children who would often torment her. In addition, she always wore a piece of cloth like a hood over her head to hide her face. This was because she must have had some kind of cancer that was eating away at her nose and facial features. The rumor was that she had "leprosy." "Raggedy Ann" lived out by the lake in an old lean to. All us kids were frightened by her. And there were lots of legends about her, like how if she looked you in the eye you were hexed.
Now I was grown...but I still thought her to be kind of a sad, but creepy character.
That afternoon, when my son spotted her, she was trudging along the side of the road in the bar ditch,on her way out to the lake. He was silent for some time, watching her intently until we passed her.
Then he turned to me (he was standing in the front seat next to me -- this was the days before car seats and seat belts!) and asked in his lisping 2 year old way and asked, "Mommy, dat Dee-doos?"
"No, honey," I responded, with a smile, thinking how "cute" he was to mistake her robed appearance as that of Jesus. "That's just old Raggedy Ann."
He turned around and looked at the figure, now disappearing behind us. Then he turned to me and, looking me in the eye with great seriousness, he said resolutely, "No, Mommy -- dat Dee-doos."
And suddenly I realized that the child knew a truth I could not grasp. And I wept.
RevKK in OK (Oklahoma!)
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 04:14:08
As I have been thinking about this passage, I can't help but think of the Great Commandment... you shall love God with all your, etc... and love your neighbor as yourself. Can it be that there is some of this in this passage... Our love for God must show itself in our love of our neighbors. We cannot separate our love for God and our love for each other. When we care for another we are in fact showing God how we feel about Him... after we are created in His image. Can it be, love for God and love for others are inseperable? Just thinking... David on South Padre Island, Texas
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 04:14:35
As I have been thinking about this passage, I can't help but think of the Great Commandment... you shall love God with all your, etc... and love your neighbor as yourself. Can it be that there is some of this in this passage... Our love for God must show itself in our love of our neighbors. We cannot separate our love for God and our love for each other. When we care for another we are in fact showing God how we feel about Him... after we are created in His image. Can it be, love for God and love for others are inseperable? Just thinking... David on South Padre Island, Texas
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 04:16:30
Sorry, previous post should read... After ALL we are created in God's image... David SPI, TX
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 04:51:56
To David, Texas...
You remembered the scripture, love God AND love our neighbors as ourselves.
Can we authentically respond to the needs of Another from a motivation of love for An Other unless we are able to love God AND Ourselves?
Do we not have to recognize the presence of Christ in our selves before we can respond to the Christ in Another?
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 04:54:37
Greetings:
Hopefully we don't do good works because they gain us salvation. If our faith saves us then it saves us. Hopefully we do good works simply because good works are good.
It gets back to that age old question. If God saves everyone, then why try to be good.
Well, because it's good to be good.
Goodness is an end and not a means. If our faith is in the right place, then this will be self apparent and good works will follow. Concentrate on Faith and not good works.
WJA in CA.
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 05:17:56
My dear friends,
I apologize, but in order to post the following, I had to break it into two parts. I am not sure if the problem was with my java program or if the wish is to shorten the posts. I will dialogue with Frank and if the latter is the case, then of course, I will comply.
My hope is that you will not be offended by the following, for certainly, that is not my intent. I readily admit that I would not offer this up in every congregation. Some would not have the ears to hear. For some, it might even be hurtful. Yet, I convey it to you as it happened. Curt (name changed to protect the guilty) is my close friend, mentor, and one of the wisest of folks. I love him dearly, and if you would know him, you would love him too. I offer this as my gift to him, and my gift to you, for if this story is anything, it is a story of the reality of life and the reality of love.
Part 1.
It was that kind of place, a place which in no small measure bore his persona. A place where each and every day, a miracle might occur. Not a big miracle you understand. Just some small thing, some bit of hope in the face of oppressive despair. Some brief flash of joy in an otherwise miserable existence, a cup of coffee offered by gentle hands, or perhaps nothing more than a smile - a miracle, you know, when one is never smiled upon. Indeed it was that kind of place - Curt Hooper's place.
How we loved to go there, to be in at least some minute way, part of the miracle. As we would work, Curt would chat with us, never meaning to preach, yet always soon slipping into his best pulpit voice, honed from 35 years as a Presbyterian minister. He would talk about justice and peace and the struggle for freedom. He spoke of great joy and endless sorrow. He would pronounce the stories of success and convey the darkness of nightmares. He would talk as one who knew the pain and suffering of the other. He would speak from countless hurts and a thousand shattered dreams. And in every story, in every utterance, his love for these forgotten, broken ones would wash over us, lifting us up and bringing us life. How he loved them.
And each day they came, these friends of Curt. They shuffled through the door by the dozens, generally with heads lowered, their dead-fish eyes staring dumbly from faces that offered wordless expressions. They came to this place where they might find a pair of unsoiled pants, or maybe a coat to wear as they made their way about the cold concrete of the city. They came for food that for them, was often in short supply. They came because maybe in the coming, it might mean that their sick child might have medication for one more week, or that their family might stay off the streets for another month, or that their father might struggle to learn one more word leading to being truly literate.
Their stories for coming were as varied as their faces, a kaleidoscope of scarcity in a world of abundance. But for more than any other reason, they came because at least at this place, they were always welcomed. Here, Curt ensured that they were embraced and celebrated and loved.
Yet, even then, even with the best and most wondrous of intentions, their coming and their being was not always an activity of beauty. Sometimes it was a scene of chaos and bitterness. Oftentimes, the rawness of life on the edge would spill over into this place of hope. For one gets angry from always being on the bottom. One gets angry when all one faces is another barrier, when all activity from dawn to dusk is punctuated by lack. One gets angry when one's children never have new toys with which to play or a bicycle to ride, when one's wife never gets to wear a dress that has not been worn by some other man's wife, when one's husband never seems to make enough, even when he works and works and works. One gets angry. And sometimes it just explodes.
It must have been that kind of day when we found him, sitting - head in his hands, glasses on the desk in front of him - sitting, looking like a man with no life left to give, drained and as broken as any of these whom he served. He scarcely looked up as we entered the room. He hardly acknowledged our existence as we made ourselves comfortable in the battered chairs sitting across from his ancient desk. We tried to offer up a bit of comfort, some ray of sunshine in the despondency of the moment.
Yet, nothing seemed to make any difference, until one of us happily remembered the very words which Curt had offered to us. He smiled at Curt and exclaimed, "I know you are having a bad day, Curt. But you are so fortunate, for no matter how bad the day is, each time someone who is in need comes through those doors, it is Jesus who enters."
For long moments Curt did not respond. For long moments he just sat and pondered these words, reflecting on them, weighing their impact in his life. Then, he slowly raised his head, gave us a small weary smile and said …
"Yeah. And sometimes Jesus can be a real son-of-a-bitch."
Truth. Hard and brutal, spoken from one who loves and lives and cares more than any other. Truth. Wrapped in no sweet platitudes, cloaked with no simple clichés, masked in no outer garments of false civility. Curt spoke the truth, the truth of loving the unlovable, the truth of loving the unwashed, the unwanted - the hungry, the thirsty, the naked - the angry, the beaten, the battered - the stranger, the sick, the prisoner. He spoke of loving in the face of hatred and even there, especially there, finding the face of God.
I haven't seen Curt lately. We live in different cities now. But, you know, I don't worry about him. For I know he lives in that place called Kingdom, that place where he embraces and loves the Christ - who might just be a real son-of-a-bitch.
Shalom my friends, Nail-Bender in NC
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 05:47:18
Dear friends, As I have read and pondered the text this week, two thoughts have certainly played across my mind ...
As Christians, I would suppose that most of us affirm and pronounce life after death.
As Christians, shouldn't we also affirm and pronounce life before death?
For PaideiaSCO and Revup, Thank you so much for your uplifting words.
Shalom, Nail-Bender in NC
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 06:12:19
In relationt to loving God and neighbor as self. One of my favorite story/images is from the early church father, Dorortheos of Gaza. He draws a wheel with a hub at the center an spokes going out to the edge. In short, God is at the center, we are the spokes. We cannot draw near to God without drawing near to others. Inversely, we cannot turn our backs on others without turning our backs on God.
It seems that somehow this fits with the story of the text. To draw near to those in need, is to draw near to Christ.
Just an image. I hope might be helpful.
Kelly on the WA sound
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 07:29:30
It is interesting to me that this Scripture lesson comes up on the Sunday before Thanksgiving here in the USA. For many folks in my pews that is what they are expecting to here on this Sunday. I can either pertend they are not expecting a Thanksgiving sermon or look at this scripture in relationship to thanksgiving. It seems to me a thankful heart is one of the things that motivates we Christians to feed, cloth and minister to the least of these. It is when we don't have a heart that sees our blessings as gifts from a loving God that we can look right past the lease of these, indeed right past Jesus himself. The thankfulness Christ calls us to is not one that is self centered but one that is active and outward, sharing out of a thankful heart. We can find ourselves thanking God for what he has done for us instead of what he has done for the whole world. I think this scripture can be revelant to a thanksgiving mind set for it is Christ the King who inspires us to know true thanksgiving. Any other insights? BY IN PA
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 12:37:24
Nailbender,
Why would anyone take offense to the branding of people, who in some vague and mysterious way, represent Christ, or even are the embodiment of Jesus, as sons-of-bitches.
Let's not also forget that they can be bastards as well... Seems to fit.
Anyone one else have loving pet-names for God and his children. How about ass-holes... dick-heads...
Where does it end?
Rick in Va
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 13:38:41
In response to the man who, so diligently & faithfully, provided for the immediate needs of the poor:
Wasn't it easier for him to be faithful to the literal interpretation of this scripture than for congrgants in the mainstream.
How many of us would rather be in this man's place?
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 13:57:17
Brother Rick and others,
Let me say that you have been offended by a very real event offered as a gift and spoken out of love for the least, love for Christ, and love for you.
Apparently, you did not "get" the message of the story. It saddens me that you might take a story which speaks to the frustration and misery of one who serves each and every day in some of the most hopeless of circumstances and view it in a way that only demeans his most heartfelt and honest response. The point is that serving those folks whom Tex Sample calls the "hard-living" is hard stuff. If we cannot get by our superficial overly-pious attitudes than we will never truly reach those about whom Jesus speaks. Curt's response was one that did not demean the folks who came in, only spoke to his embrace and love and COMMITMENT to them, commitment to this one called Jesus who constantly ate, drank, and walked with sinners.
Rick, I am not offended by your words for I have sat with far too many battered and beaten and broken people who have known nothing but hurt and misery and anger to have not heard all of those before and more. However, I am asking that Frank pull the story. I truly thought that most would understand the nature of Jesus. But alas, I guess for many being approached by the least of these will only result in dismissal, derision, and down-right hatred.
It really is sad. So, I guess we really do crucify the Christ. I guess we really can't embrace the broken, the nasty, the hurt, the hungry, the PRISONER.
God have mercy on us.
Shalom, Deeply saddened Nail-Bender in NC
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 14:24:32
Thank-you, Nail-bender, for that marvelous story about Curt. You're right--not all congregations would be ready for this image--but I hope that as we grow spiritually, we become able to acknowlege and love Jesus, the son-of-a-bitch. If we can see him only in those folks we experience as lovable, we'll sure miss him a lot. After all, Jesus gave us images of God as loving father, good shepherd, AND unjust judge (the 1st century version of a son-of-a-bitch?). Those days when all we see around us are unjust judges and sons(or daughters)-of-bitches, it's a real gift to find God even there. --Alma
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 15:00:05
when we begin to accept true faith the works come automatically. Faith without deed simply put- we are only scimming the surface. Grace being the gift of a God that loves us even if we only skim as long as our heart is upon us. If you believe in the resurection of the dead you know that the day of our Lord is upon each and every one of us and the we must always be prepared
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 15:21:16
Nailbender,
Thank you very much for your story. I have found it helpful for sermon perparation. It is never easy to see Jesus in all people. I admire your friend who was honest enough to admit the difficulty and yet continued to respond in love. If we look at the multitudes of people that Jesus responded to in love, we can see that they too were often difficult to love. Thanks again for your contribution. Simka
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 17:40:12
I wonder if it is even possible for us to see God in the "least" without the help of God. Since not even the sheep saw God in those they fed, should we bother trying to fix our "eyes" to see God, or should we be working to fix our hands that don't want to move without seeing first.
I am reminded of John Wesley when he was deppressed and unsure of his faith. His friend came to him and said, "preach faith until you have it, and then preach faith even more because you have it."
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 18:25:27
Blessings and peace to you all: thank you for feeding this little goat this week...
I have few ideas to add:
1. As I read this passage, I struggle with the "eternal fire" and with the questions about faith and works so eloquently discussed here already. One thing about the goats who are damned, is that they are already in hell long before this judgement day -- aren't we all in a hell of our own making when we are isolated from our brothers and sisters, blind to their need, and concerned only with our own security? I think it is the flip side of the "already/not yet" nature of the kingdom: hell, too, is already and not yet. The Good News is that we who are goats today are still called into the flock -- Jesus calls us by name out of our isolation and fear and into the blessed flock. Knowing this can give us the courage to reach out to others: not in order to save our own hides but out of gratitude and love and with then same unselfconscousness as all those in the parable: "Lord, when did I?..."
2. Harry Wendt of Crossways says that there are only two people in the world: me and Jesus -- where is Jesus you ask? Look at all the others all around: there is JEsus. And they see Jesus in me.
3. We almost always read this passage from the perspective of the giver: the one who turns to the needy in charity with clothing and food etc. WE ALSO NEED to see that we RECEIVE from others, too! The caring and love are circular and all of us little images of Jesus give and receive from other members of the body: its not about charity, its about love.
Blessings, Preachers!
Preacher Woman in Philadelphia, PA
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 20:01:07
Off-Topic:
Nailbender,
You say that you are saddenned that I didn’t get it. Please don’t be arrogant about what I do and don’t get. I got ‘it’. Your story was touching and poignant as always. And the stressing of social service is a necessity in this day of selfishness. However, why do we need to profane God while stressing social service?
God is certainly loving and merciful and the essence of humanness, especially towards the least of these.
He is also Holy and unapproachable and defines our need for a mediator and savior in His Son Jesus Christ.
You write that you asked Frank to remove your post. I asked Frank to remove mine. I wrote my words out of a sense of total frustration.
I saw the film Dogma two days ago. As one who has problems with some Catholic doctrine, as one who winces at some of the antics of organized religion, I was still stunned by the blasphemy of the film. (One character smirked about how sexually excited he became after kissing the character portraying God in the film… this was one of the minor offenses).
And now, I read on this site that calling Christ a son-of-a-bitch to make a point is not out-of-bounds.
Sadness indeed.
Nailbender, can we agree that the world could use a little more holiness? You probably define it a little differently than I do. Perhaps not. But the profaning of the name of God, no matter what the purpose, is a slippery slope I desire us to stay off of. If we can get away with that, for what do we need a Savior?
Rick in Va
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 20:42:58
I apologize for throwing this in so late in the week and in two parts also. But I felt it is something to think about and I would like some reflections by others to help me sort it out. I agree with the author, but I am still wrestling with the implication of what I am coming to understand.
According to Marion Soards in "Preaching the Revised Common Lectionary", the story does not deal with those who both know and serve him. As the writer puts it, "One of the curious elements of this story is that both the sheep and the goats are surprised. The sheep have served Christ without knowing him, and the goats have known Christ without serving him." Ooh, that's smarts!
But I do like the comment toward the end of the chapter: "The lesson tells us about the fate of all but the active Christians, so that we are given a pair of lessons: First, we learn of Christ's capacity to judge tho9se who have never known him. Second, we are shown that lip service is not enough. More than anything this text strives to startle complacent Christians into an active life of faith."
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 20:43:44
Part Two:
I struggle with this, as several of you have done, because it sounds almost like salvation based on work and not grace. But Soards also wrote, "We read nothing in Christ's list about a profession of faith, and indeed the last thing the sheep seem to have ahd was a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. This is not a slam at contemporary evangelical concerns, but it is a reminder that purely personal piety is not all that Christ calls for and expects. This scene of a final judgment is part of Matthew's total Gospel, and in that complete work there are other passages that balance this one with its heavy emphasis on action. Moreover, Matthew's Gospel finds its place in the context of the canon of scripture from which it is clear that a strong relationship between God and the human(s) is indeed a central part of God's purposes of working through the history of Israel and in the person of Jesus Christ. The heart of the gospel is that we have a relationship to God in Christ and we find the directions for our living both by grace."
What is helping me understand what Soards is writing is a story in the newspaper today about a Jewish girl donating money she got from her bat mitzvah to a high school so that books could be bought for some of the classrooms. Let me share what the newspaper article from the Los Angeles Times began with:
When Dorsey High School teacher Alfee Enciso wrote and opinion page essay urging wealthy donors to spread their wealth to impoverished inner-city schools, he had no idea how quickly his prayer would be answered.
Or that manna would be forth-coming not from a Bill Gates or a Rupert Murdoch but from Julie Byren.
Who?
The Hermosa Beach 13-year-old, an avid volleyball player and rock climber, read Enciso's plea and was the only one to respond. She turned over $800 of the gift money she received at her recent bat mitzvah, on the condition that the funds be used to buy books for Dorsey classrooms bereft of reading materials.
A sheep who does not know Christ but is serving him. How many Christians claim to know Christ, but are not serving him?
Something to think about. Hopefully, I'll have more as I wrestle with the passage.
Brandon in CA
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 20:45:17
Revup, Lots of commentators see Matthew as written for believers. In the intro to Leon Morris' commentary on Matthew he sums up the thinking. Kilpatrick viewed this Gospel as a lectionary for the early church (Leon Morris "The Gospel According to Matthew" William B. Eerdmans Publishing Co. Grand Rapids, MI, 1999. pg. 4) Morris thinks, "That it was written to be used as a lectionary. . . is highly unlikely." (pg. 5) although he asserts that it is "clear" that it was used in church services. It has been "compared...[in] form with the Manual of Discipline from Qumran... the comparison of Matthew to the Manual of Discipline is often accepted." Douglas Hare (my professor for a seminary course on the Gospel of Matthew) and a well known scholar believes Matthew was written to speak to an early church composed of both Jewish Christians and new, gentile Christians who were under serious persecution from the Jewish community (probably AD 85 although earlier dates, even AD 50-60 are proposed). The concept of winning converts in that community was being abandoned and the call to reach the gentile world was being assumed. Matthew, as Morris notes, is the only Gospel writer to use the word "church (16:18, 18:17) and wants to strengthen the early church organization. The reason many assume Matthew wrote for the Jews is that he, "...seems concerned throughout to show that Christianity is the true continuation of the Old Testament-- true Judaism... He was clearly a knowledgeable Jew..." (Morris pg.2) Hope this was not more than you wanted! DL in ME
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 20:46:42
Off Topic (more or less)
There is an irony. at least for some of us, in the people we deal with daily. Whether they are wealthy church members that feel they have a right to (hatever), or in-your-face down and out types that demand your time no matter what, or the absolute sweetest soul on earth --- the challenge is always to see them as Christ. And sometimes that is nearly impossible.... Jesus wouldn't treat me like that, would he? And the answer is: I hope not. Yet, when we deal with people who try our patience, we see Christ in them- not Christ only, but Christ the King -- and sometimes Christ can be a little testy.
As for me, Nail Bender, I laughed out loud.
HW in HI (Hawai'i)
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 22:16:45
We don't see, we have goat's eyes and a goat's heart - we are too focused on ourselves and our success (however you define it, i.e. salvation, money, popularity, etc). Compassion has become impersonal, we have lost our concern for the common good - we hate each other for the positions we take (i.e. abortion, death penalty, the poor, the homeless -- just name it!) and we have lost our sense of community. Without community we have nothing to bring the sick, the imprisoned, the hungry, the naked into, we cannot cloth them unless we have a way to house them. The challenge is great for we must move beyond the illusions of caring.
tom in ga
Date: 18 Nov 1999
Time: 23:54:31
Brother Rick, As always, I do appreciate the contrast which you bring to my life. Thank you. And, you are right, I should not have been so arrogant.
However, I do disagree that the story profanes the name of God. In fact, I suggest that seeing the face of Jesus in one who is a broken, sinful creature is firmly connected to the realm of God. In seeing the Christ even through all the dirt and ugliness, one engages in the most Holy of pursuits, one engages in the in the task of love.
For that is what God does to us. That is what Jesus is saying in this passage. "Meet me in the brokeness. Meet me in that place where the world says I do not dwell." And note the response of those whom cared for the broken, it is the response of surprise. They simply never knew that it was Jesus in their midst. They had no idea that it was the Christ who came to them or Christ to whom they went. Likewise, this is the same response of the "goats." They never knew that they were walking by the Christ, refusing to see him in the ugliness, in the nakedness, in the brokeness. Ultimately, they are cast out, beyond the realm of Kingdom - not because they were malicious, but because they were blind. Jesus seems to say, "you do not see."
I think tom in ga has it right, unless we can be community, unless we can open ourselves up and become vulnerable to one another, you and I, all of us, we have nothing to bring. Curt understood this truth, as he opened himself up to the other, even to the point of grief, even to the point of the cross. For Curt understood that he could only reach out to the brokeness, through HIS OWN BROKENESS. Curt could only make his comment, because he too fell under the same sin, the same hurt, the same emptiness as those to whom he served. And yet, it was here, in their pain and in his, where he found the incarnate Christ, where he found life.
Finally, though we don't like to admit this, but this is the only place in scripture where Jesus speaks directly to how we will be judged - whether or not we see him in the least. The strange thing is, we spend most of our time trying to get on the other side of the question, how we might be relevant (oh, how we love to be relevant), not how we might become the least … how we might become as Christ.
Shalom my friend, Nail-Bender in NC
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 00:57:39
David on South Padre Island, Texas: Great minds think alike. Since this is Bible Sunday, I am using the Mt. 25 text as my primary text, with Mt. 22:34-40 (love God and love others) as an additional text. I will point out the two primary things the Bible teaches are: 1 love God with all your soul, heart and strength (which means receiving and giving your life to Him) 2 love others as yourself (which includes by loving others we are actually loving God) Thus, I hope to show Jesus as King, (Christ the King Sunday) the Bible is God's vital Word (Bible Sunday) and so we need to follow the Biblle and love God and others. revup
PS:Why does the UMC complicate things by putting "Bible Sunday" on "Christ the King Sunday?"
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 01:02:07
NailBender,
The story does not profane the name of God. The story, again, is poignant. Pieces of the story do.
As sheep, we have far too many goat-like moments, many of them unwittingly, more of them willfully. I think that your friend Curt is doing the Lord's work. I also think that as a Shepherd of the Lord's sheep, he is asked, even when amongst the least, to maintain that aspect of God's holiness that the Scriptures testify to. When we are to see Jesus in each other, we are not to see sons-of-bitches. That is my only point. We are to see that part of God that is holy. We are to encourage others to do the same. Seeing others as sons-of-bitches is, in my inarticulate view, seeing ourselves in Christ, rather than seeing Christ in ourselves. There is an important difference.
Seeing ourselves in Christ, is seeing Christ as a son-of-a-bitch, someone who is not divine, someone who is not a redeemer, someone who is a sinner just like us, someone with too many goat-like moments. That is not the Christ of Scripture.
Seeing Christ in each other, is seeing each other as creations of God, goat-like at times, but sheep nevertheless. I believe that distinction is incredibly important.
Noone on this site NailBender, has made me think more about my faith, than you have. You, most eloquently, have been a champion of the view that faith without works is a dead faith. On that, you and I can and do agree.
But my friend, never forget that Christ is not just a champion of the poor, the oppressed, the discarded, the outcast, the forgotten, and the least. He is Savior and Redeemer of the world. And if we think of Him only in terms of the former, then we are indeed a sad, and futile, bunch.
Rick in Va
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 01:28:38
Greetings in the name of Christ Jesus.
This is my first time visiting this site. I am a young person of 19yrs who is attending Confirmation calsses where we discuss the weekly Gospel. In fact Rev. from Downunder is the Priest conducting these classes. So I thought I might drop in and post some of my ideas.
This weeks Gospel, for me, has a strong message. The Gospel clearly says to me that those who have been given greatness by God should share their gifts with those who are less fortunate.
By greatness I mean wealth and a good lifestyle. For as Christ says when we help one of the least we are helping him, for he is present in all of us.
I also think that the message from the Gospel this week could have another less obviouse meaning, speaking in terms of not necessarily good works, but in accepting or rejecting Christ.
In helping the poor and the hungry, as the sheep have done, they have accpted Christ (represented by the less fortunate in the Gospel) into their lives showing him love, as the sheep did to the poor, the hungry and the sick. The goats may, in a sense, have rejected Christ in not doing as he has commanded us, by not loving their neighobours. And therefor have been condemed to 'the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angles' not directly for ignoring the poor and destitute, but for rejecting Christ and his teaching of love for all.
Like I said at the start of this posting I am in no way trained to preach and I am not sure how helpful any of this will be. But these are just my views on the Gospel as I see it. If anyone wishes to I can be contacted at q9822048@mail.connect.usq.edu.au
The Peace and the Love of Christ be with you all,
Brenden from Oz
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 01:29:17
Greetings in the name of Christ Jesus.
This is my first time visiting this site. I am a young person of 19yrs who is attending Confirmation calsses where we discuss the weekly Gospel. In fact Rev. from Downunder is the Priest conducting these classes. So I thought I might drop in and post some of my ideas.
This weeks Gospel, for me, has a strong message. The Gospel clearly says to me that those who have been given greatness by God should share their gifts with those who are less fortunate.
By greatness I mean wealth and a good lifestyle. For as Christ says when we help one of the least we are helping him, for he is present in all of us.
I also think that the message from the Gospel this week could have another less obviouse meaning, speaking in terms of not necessarily good works, but in accepting or rejecting Christ.
In helping the poor and the hungry, as the sheep have done, they have accpted Christ (represented by the less fortunate in the Gospel) into their lives showing him love, as the sheep did to the poor, the hungry and the sick. The goats may, in a sense, have rejected Christ in not doing as he has commanded us, by not loving their neighobours. And therefor have been condemed to 'the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angles' not directly for ignoring the poor and destitute, but for rejecting Christ and his teaching of love for all.
Like I said at the start of this posting I am in no way trained to preach and I am not sure how helpful any of this will be. But these are just my views on the Gospel as I see it. If anyone wishes to I can be contacted at q9822048@mail.connect.usq.edu.au
The Peace and the Love of Christ be with you all,
Brenden from Oz
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 01:32:14
I wish to appologise for my contribution being poted twice, I do not know why it happened, I only submitted it once. So, who knows? Yet agian, my apologies.
Brenden from Oz
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 01:43:03
Nailbender,
Keep giving us those great stories. I found it very moving, and very insightful. We are often told that are to try to see Jesus in everyone, but we seldom think of seeing him in people who are mean and nasty. This helped me to see that Jesus can indeed be seen in everyone - even those who sometimes act like "Sons of bitches."
The story, by the way, would not have been nearly as effective without that line: "And sometimes Jesus can be a real son-of-a-bitch." I didn't take it literally, that you (or "Curt") was taking the name of Jesus in vain. Only that he can at times be seen in those who act like sons-of-bitches.
Ron in Canada
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 04:12:15
I was struck by a comment from Rick in VA "Seeing Christ in each other, is seeing each other as creations of God, goat-like at times, but sheep nevertheless. I believe that distinction is incredibly important." We Lutheran's have a whole set of doctrines about that. We are "simil justis et peccator" simultaniously saints and sinners. We are saints because of what Christ has done for us by dieing on the cross - but we still falter and fail and outright disobey. Mehrke in South Dakota
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 06:11:55
One of the things I hope to highlight in this week's sermon is what this passage tells us about our table fellowship: that at the table, we not only meet Jesus, but also our enemy - the one who is least in our eyes. If we are judged by our ministry to the least, then it is at the table, in a sense, where we meet him/her. At the table, Christ removes all distinctions, not only male/female, gentile/jew, but also black/white, gay/straight, friend/foe. He is the one to do the judging. We may only minister. Ultimately, it is then Christ in us ministering to Christ in another, that he may "be all and in all." The response he calls for, then, is not one of "works," but opf faith - faith to see him in the other, even the enemy - that which our eyes cannot on any account see.
On another note - how easy it is to minister to people when it is "us" ministering to "them." But such ministering maintains differences, and it is no wonder that it is not well-received by the "beneficiaries" of our good works. The ministry Jesus calls forth from us is of a different sort - recognizing that all that separates us is which side of the table we sit at. Those who minister well are those who do not differentiate between "us" and "them." Paul, in his ministry, said that he would be willing to lose his own salvation for the sake of his people. The O.T. said that the one hanging on a tree was cursed, but Jesus was willing to bear the curse for us. The one who truly enters into ministry is the one who is willing to give up his own righteousness, his own respect, for the sake of the other.
Gary in New Bern
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 09:01:16
It has been interesting to see where the discussion might lead. It is amazing to see how the vine of thought has sought the truth.
I submit a few more thoughtI have been considering.
I see a comparison in this passage with Matthew 13:24-30. "The parable of the tares and the wheat." I indicated in my last posting that the nature of Matthew's 25th chapter reveals to us, the God that "makes" us wait, and what waiting means in relation to living the life of faith and love. It is very easy to say, "I love you", when the moment is ripe. We see this in human relationships. Peter found how difficult it is to maintain that promise, even when it is put to relatively simple tests, in denying Christ 3 times. We seem to want to use these texts then to identify some sort of formula, for what it means to be living out the Christian life. If I do A,B, or C, I am loving as Christ wants me to. I have to wonder whether this entire chapter tells us something about the conversion "process" itself. The process of being "born again" The development of the image of God within. Questions arise from this passage in relation to our not being able to tell, who truly is living the Christian way. Why does God wait this seemingly interminable time for us to prove our faith and love? Anyone can be charitable for short periods. Why isn't the world converted in an instant? Why do we have to live on, after we have confessed our faith in Christ?Because, I believe that is the whole point of God's purpose. It isn't at the instant where I say "I do", that a marriage is complete, it is only in what follows. And further, I do not believe we can fully appreciate how other people receive our love. It is usually when we are not intentional about it that the greatest ministry of Christ is performed through us. We supposed Christians, always seem so apparently smug when it comes to these division texts. We say to God, we know which ones are wheat and which are weeds, (sheep or goats), and worse how to determine the difference. Only at our life's end, does it become apparent to God, which one we, and others, really are. In the meantime, we are to live our everyday lives, in constant awareness of the nearness of the kingdom of God. In my ministry, when I am alert, I see naked, hungry, thirsty and imprisoned people everyday. "WE" are everywhere. These are spiritual terms relating to the nature of people's relationships with God and with each other. Our life's ultimate destiny will be determined by how we respond to that in ourselves and in the lives of others. Essentially the message of Hebrews - "Salvation by faith." And connected with Jesus's message last week, "Well done, good and faithful servant"! You have used your gift of life correctly.
Sorry, I seem to have prattled on a bit. Thank-you all for the opportunity to mull over these things and to air my humble thoughts.
KGB in Aussie.
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 15:35:14
In response to Gary-New Bern's concern about the "them-ness " and " us-ness " in the text:
That projection from the text has gnawed at me all week. At face value, " them-ness " and " us-ness ", the " privileged " and the " under-privileged ", rich and poor ( class distinctions ), is not consistent with my experience with God and with my discernment of scripture.
" Them and Us " thinkin' creates barriers between the family of God which prevent our experience of God's Kingdom, the New Order. The old order is like a ladder, separated by rungs, some " up ", some " down " and the New Order is like a circle.
When I discern this text in a way which re-enforces those distinctions, I believe that I am moving in a direction which is contrary to God's intention.
How would someone, who is physically hungry, who doesn't have sufficient clothing to meet the season, who has TB and no insurance carrier, read this text? Are they excluded?...couldn't be a sheep or a goat.
If we broaden the interpretation of the text to include all people, then, maybe some of Curt's friends would be called to meet his broken-ness, discouragement and alienation that day when Nail Bender found him dispondent. Wouldn't that experience really remove some barriers? Talk about a Kingdom experience, a dismantling of barriers. Serving one another is not just a privilege of the Privileged, in my opinion.
Is there another animal in the story to represent the character who is physically hungry ?
How can a text be written for only one group of people, ( 1 )those who have the resources to provide for physical needs and respond and ( 2 ) those who have resources to provide for the physical needs and don't respond.
Maybe this is a realized eschatology text reminding us that the Kingdom of God is now, calling our attention to the necessity for alertness. Maybe somedays we are goats and somedays we are sheep. Goat:Somedays the Christ within us is makin' a big ruckus closer to the surface, trying to attract a sheep for help. We are the hungry, naked, sick and lonley. Sheep:Somedays, the Christ within us is nudging us to notice those who are hungry, sick, naked and lonely. I speak from experience. Most of my ministry has been with people in poverty. Some of my ministry has produced an arrogance because I have identified with the Sheep in this text, especially when I have been a guest in a wealthy church. Some of my ministry has been WITH those in poverty, meaning less barriers, and being vulnerable to the love WITH, not just TO, others. I have recognized times when I have been " the least " and those who had little food and sparse clothing have given to me.
I genuinely believe this text is more about removing barriers and recognizing the God's presence in all of us.
Kairos
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 15:47:26
Brother Rick,
To your post on 01:02:07 -- Thank you. Really well spoken and I think I understand exactly where you are coming from, and do agree with you. Truly, I know that Curt did not think of those whom he serves as any other less than the beautiful and broken children of God. More than I will ever be able to do (though I struggle), he embraces and loves the apparently unlovable. In the end, that was my point. Not that the folks were SOBs, but that beyond the realm of Kingdom, that is who most of "the world" claim them to be. Yet, that is just it. God sees us/them in a light other than the view "the world" offers. Jesus never speaks to whether the least are worthy of love or not, Jesus just says in embracing the least, you embrace me. And it seems so hard to embrace that which most appalls us, that which most represents our own fears.
That is why this passage is so difficult for us not only to claim, but to live. It is hard to embrace the one who we see as the other, the one who most crowds our comforts zones, and reminds us of our own brokeness.
I spend my life trying to live this passage both vocationally and occupationally. I truly believe that it is Christ who I embrace, and yet, it seems that so often I fail - so often I find myself firmly in the camp of the goats. Make no mistake, this is hard stuff. And without the community of faith to wrap around us, it is impossible. In the end, we are all broken, and all connected through our brokeness, and all connected through the brokeness and wholeness of Christ. Perhaps, ultimately, that was my point.
Shalom my friends, Nail-Bender in NC
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 15:56:21
Brother Rick and all other friends,
One last point to the above. As we embrace the brokeness of the least, we embrace the brokeness of Christ. This too is hard. We, especially in the Protestant community, really have a difficult time in embracing the broken, bleeding one who hangs on the cross. As Father Richard Rohr so beautifully states, it is impossible to embrace the risen Christ, without also embracing the broken Christ. We simply can't have one without the other. To seek to do so, denies the incarnate One. And in refusing the broken Christ, we also refuse that broken part of our own lives. We continue to embrace our sin and refuse the healing power of the resurrected One. Finally, we only embrace the least, both without and within, through the Grace which loves without regard to worth.
Shalom, Nail-Bender in NC
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 16:30:13
I am entitling my sermon, "Do We Need to Separate the Sheep from the Goats?". Obviously, Jesus, the Great Shepherd, does do some separating. But, is that our job?
It is easy for us to be nice to those like us, whether they be of the same social class or the same theological persuasion. Yet, the tension comes when we are to love our neighbors (whom might be our enemies).
I am reminded of a youth group I once worked with. Those of us leaders who were older, had to laugh at the college age male leaders. They always felt "called" to minister to the cheerleaders and to the attractive young ladies.. They needed to recognize the difference between their own hormones calling and the spiritual call of God.
How often I remember that image. We, in our humanity, are all like these young men. We are tempted and seduced in a varieyt of ways. We gravitate toward that and those whom we find attractive. Keeping this in mind, I have struggled hard to be one who looks for the ugly and those on the fringes to minister to. Always looking to challenge the boundaries of my comfort zone.
Yet, this type of ministry does not have much external affirmation. My churches sometimes are jealous because I spend too much time with the goats instead of with the sheep that I was called to. Others are upset when I share my vision with them, because working with fringe people, the homeless and hungry, is not efficient. Their needs are always changing and sometimes difficult to address quickly.
And, last but not least, I sometimes get discouraged. So much of ministering to people is like the proverbial "drop in the bucket". Perhaps it would be easier for me and my family to stick to the sheep, and send the goats to Social Services. Not many I know would criticize me for doing that.
But herein lies the rub: just who are the sheep and who are the goats? Who are the saints and (using the already discussed phrase) who are the sons-of-bitches? I admit I find the latter in my pews just as I do in the streets. Those that seem to be ungrateful, and often demanding and whiny, not unlike adolescents. People who appear to not know what they want or need.
And yet, there are those who continued to put up with me. Despite how I looked or thought. Despite my theology.
Do WE need to separate the sheep from the goats?
Perhaps the thankful part of the holiday spirit is that the Christian message of loving neighbor still lives on, even if often limited to one season. We don't have to worry about who is who, we merely are to be gracious to all who pass by in need, like the cobbler in the story above.
Just some ramblings..... Scott from NY
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 17:38:53
Scott from New York:
I understood you to define " sheep " as persons who served the physically hungry, thirsty, naked, lonely and sick.... and " goats " as all the other people, to include both those who did not respond to the physical needs of others those who had the physical needs themselves.
Did I misunderstand?
MsRev
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 18:03:00
I share something that occured to me today as I was rereading this text. In verse 40, we are told the 'least of these' are the king's brethren. It occured to me that they are part of the royal family, and yet we pass by them as if they aren't even part of the human family. May God give us eyes of the heart that we may see all people as God's precious creation. Legs in Las Vegas
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 18:09:24
I share with you a thought which occured to me today upon rereading this text. In verse 40, we are told that the 'least of these' are the king's brothers. Therefore they are part of the royal family. And yet, how often we pass by the 'least of these' as if they aren't even part of the human family. May God give us eyes of the heart that we may see all people as God's precious creation.
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 19:29:08
I have been reading the comments for some time and this is the very first time I have ever responded to one of these sites. Just thought I would share a simple idea for this text. Perhaps this text serves as an appropriate 'snapshot' of what the church is supposed to look like. The question is, "Do you look like your picture?"
The Blacksmith
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 22:23:37
Legs in LasVegas:
Thank you. I had the very same thought today. This is the royal family - those intimatly connected to Christ. Camille in NC
Date: 19 Nov 1999
Time: 23:24:11
For 19 years I served an inner city church in East Cleveland which had a hunger center and clothing bank to distribute to the poor. Every year at Christmas the basement was full of food, the Sunday School classrooms were filled with clothing, and the church lounge was full of toys. More than 2500 families would receive these gifts from well meaning Christians in the metroploitan area. I must admit I loved being and thinking of myself as a kind, "do-gooder", Santa Claus type as I would oversee the distribution. One year, two hours after our doors closed on Christmas Eve, a woman came to the door and asked if she could please get some help. She had just come from the hospital and would be going back. She was a single mom with three children. At the age of 32 she had terminal cancer. Her ID bracelet proved her sincerity. Of course I helped her and gave her as much as I could. I was feeling good and proud of myself. We even prayed for her health. When she stood at the door with all her packages, she said to me, "Thank you for making this my best Christmas ever." I was really feeling good, now. Then as she was leaving she reached over and kissed me on my cheek. That's when I saw who she was, and I will never forget seeing Him.
Date: 20 Nov 1999
Time: 00:33:06
A death bed statement attributed to St. Vincent de Paul: "We must be very humble and ask forgiveness of the poor, because we have given them charity." Charity is when we give from what we don't need, from our cast offs and our excess. I don't believe that is what Jesus was talking about. The hymn Cuando El Pobre (J. A. Oliver and Miguel Manzano) speaks more to my understanding of this parable. The first verse is: "When the poor ones who have nothing share with strangers, When the thirsty water give unto us all, When the crippled in their weakness strengthen others, then we know that God still goes that road with us, va Dios mismo en nuestro mismo caminar.
shalom, clw in co
Date: 20 Nov 1999
Time: 00:33:54
Thanks anonymous contributor for that beautiful reminder of seeing Him. If you want to share your name ok. Some of us will be using this story on Sunday. It is interesting as some have already pointed out, the Son of Man has to inform both the sheep and the goats when they had "done it unto Him." Your story reminded me of a different kind of sighting, for myself. At an automobile repair shop, I walked into the waiting room where another customer was talking on a portable phone, she was crying, and a service man place a box of Kleenex on the table before her. I really don't know why I did it, it was an automatic gesture, but when as she concluded her conversation with "Please let me know when the services will take place," I got up from my seat, and kneeling before her asked "Is there anything I could do for you?" She informed me that her best friend had died unexpectedly after a routine surgical procedure. She had just gotten the news. I got her a glass of water, listened for a few minutes, and slowly returned to my own life. She collected herself, and then made arrangements to get a ride home from the dealer. As she was leaving the waiting room, she leaned over and kissed me. "I saw Him"
Shalom
Pasthersyl
Date: 20 Nov 1999
Time: 00:45:40
My Christmas Eve epiphany was about finally understanding the Incarnation and realizing how I spent much of my time doing good so I would feel good about myself. I was the real center of all my doing. I was not poor, but I was poor in spirit. It took a solitary visit from a stranger to help me see that the Lord was in my presence. .
Date: 20 Nov 1999
Time: 00:46:21
As usual, we are appreciative to the insightful real life story shared by Nail-Bender...and especially thankful for the tough, yet tender, hearted suffering servants of the sacred covenant who know hurt beyond most of our imaginations because of what they face every moment of everyday! A 17th century Jewish mystic comes to mind, Baal-Shem tov, the father of Hasidism, who expressed the meeting of the love of God in the face of others in their need. when confronted by the question of what good purpose was it to God for some to deny his existence....And he taught: when you see your neighbor in need you are to act as if there were no God by going to minister to that need! The tough-tendered hearted minister in the story I believe did that. In the climax of worship as we prepare to "go forth" (which is the meaning of "apostle") there is a prayer of dedication appropriate to the celebration of Christ the King: "Send us, O God, as thy messengers to hearts without a home, to lives without love, to the crowds without a guide. Send us to the children whom none have blessed, to the famished whom none have visited, to the fallen whom none have lifted, to the bereaved whom none have comforted. Kindle thy flame on the altars of our hearts, that others may be warmed thereby; cause thy light to shine in our souls, that others may see the way; keep our sympathies and insight ready, our wills keen, our hands quick to help our brothers and sisters in their need; through the suffering servant, Jesus the anointed, the Christ, King of Kings, and Lord of Lords. Amen." PaideiaSCO in noth ga mts
Date: 20 Nov 1999
Time: 01:00:19
What ultimately separates the sheep from the goats is their having given something to someone in need. Maybe those who unknowingly help reach out from their own poverty of spirit. Maybe they help to help themselves. Maybe they reach out to touch the heart of another poor, another in need, and another acquainted with grief. In so doing they touch the heart of God himself and thereby inherit a kingdom. Ultimately they get to see Him when He comes in glory. If the goats do not care for Jesus when He comes to them cloaked as another, why would they want to be in his presence in glory? They seem to receive what they are most comfortable with -a place away from the heart of God, a place of their own. I once heard Mother Theresa say about the poor of Calcutta, "They give us so much." She was someone who knew the heart of God.
-Bob in Brooklyn
Date: 20 Nov 1999
Time: 01:00:40
O, that today you would harken to his voice (Psalm 95)
I confess that I live a life in abstraction - I worship God yet care little for his people. In my passivity I am selfish. I see the hunger and the suffering and do nothing. I pray but my actions are indifferent to those who cry out. I watch the news, and the crys of those who are dying are blended with the noise of advertizements, I no longer know what is important. I live a goats existence. O, I think loving thoughts, my heart is filled with charity, I hear the Great Commandment, but I go on living a life separated from those who hurt.
tom in ga
Date: 20 Nov 1999
Time: 02:37:00
Another Aussie preacher who loves this site! What I find fascinating is that this is the Gospel reading for the Sunday of Christ the King. How is Christ King? Firstly, there is the judgment - Christ has the authority and the right to separate the sheep from the goats. The last few weeks have been indicating various aspects of the end times and the judgment. Secondly, how do we live in acknowledgement that Christ is our ruler? We do the works that he did. Treating all people (the least of these)as God's children. Treating all people as people Christ came to redeem. Christ so identifies with his people that to do something for them (or not do something for them) is the same as doing something for him. Remember Saul on the Damascus Road? The voice said, "Saul, Saul why do you persecute me?" Jesus so identifies with the church that when Saul persecutes the church he persecutes Christ. Lets not spend our energies judging, labelling, separating, condemning but get on with the Christ's work and demonstrate that he is King. N.E. Sydney.
Date: 20 Nov 1999
Time: 03:57:34
Sorry folks, but as moving as so many of the contributions have been, I think we are missing the point of the reading as some earlier contributers tried to point out. As important as it is to 'seek and serve Christ in all persons' which Canadian Anglicans agree to do in the baptismal covenant (we are having two baptisms this Sunday), this reading is not about how God's people are to treat the hungry et al. It's about the judgement of the nations. If we were in the position to ask some first century Jewish Christians just who it is Jesus meant by 'all the nations', they would have said, "The Gentiles, of course, everyone who isn't Jewish." The Jewsish people believed that there would be two judgements. One would be for Israel, the people of God, who would be judged in the light of Torah. The other would be for the nation