Date: 03 Jan 2000
Time: 21:17:39
When reading this story I cannot help but remember the film, the Exorcist. Too bad. I hate to have Hollywood images taint how I encounter the text. How to read it afresh?
Is evil the bad things we choose to do or is there another dimension, one that transcends our rational, everyday world? Are there other beings in the universe beside humans? If we believe there is a God, it would be hard to answer, "No!" Is evil older than human memory? All these questions push us into a world and a worldview in which we are very uncomfortable. Yet sometimes it is good to let the Bible make us uncomfortable; it show we are being stretched.
I believe that if there are evil spirits then they are simply beings living according to a law we often see in other human beings, and even in ourselves, the love of causing other people pain. Perhaps they feed on pain, just like a food, drawing psychic energy from a suffering soul. How else do you explain the Jerry Springer show. When someone says they just have to be honest and tell their lover that he or she is sleeping with the lover's grandfather, it isn't out of a sense of "being convicted of sin." It is to shame and humiliate the first lover. And what about Jerry? What does he get out of it? Money? Yes, but there has to be something else motivating him, or all the money in the world wouldn't keep him coming back. What about the cheering, jeering crowd, lapping it up? I begin to form an image of Hell: millions of laughing, jeering demons and lost souls shouting "Satan! Satan!" And what about me for watching the show? Am I in danger of being sucked into the process? I am told that Jerry started out as a ministerial student. Now that is a frightening thought.
Boyd in NC
Date: 11 Jan 2000
Time: 04:06:11
Boyd,
Thank you for starting our discussion. I too am working at "exorcising" the tacky movie images from my reflections on this text. But then, Mark's gospel typically goes for the "high-action-drama" approach to the narratives.....
I'm wondering if the placement of this particular account in the lectionary is significant. So far, Jesus' baptism has set the scene for the long awaited Messiah, some disciples have been chosen.....it's almost as if there's 'something in the air', and the people are ready for a sign. The word on the street is that the One has come who is even more powerful than the evil of the world. The One who will conquer evil is here and will be revealed. It seems as if this dramatic act of healing power was timed perfectly.
As for the nature of evil, I'm not sure whether I will deal with that in any detail in a sermon on this text. Great lectionary study group topic, but in a sermon, I wonder if it runs the risk of trying to tie it all up neatly (in 15 minutes or less), or include it only to leave it as vague as it was to start with. It's early yet, but I wonder if it's enough to say that this is a foreshadowing of Jesus' ultimate victory over evil......
Early thoughts, SueCan
Date: 13 Jan 2000
Time: 07:38:10
A wild pot pourri of thoughts. The reading reminds me of that aspect of authority which is present when the person teaching or speaking expresses a very deep confidence about the matter at hand. That confidence I have heard described as the Spirit speaking in us and through us. We hear the message of the speaker and yet we hear the deep resonances through our own experience; we remember and link parts of our memory, our history and our daily life. We can tap into our sense of vocation, our calling as we "hear the truth" in these situations. When I have been able to do this on the odd occasion, the effect has been to create links, to increase understanding and to integrate people and their experiences with each other. False prophets rarely speak with that sort of confidence (or humility). I have heard the authority of Jesus in this reading desribed in "command" terms. I am quite relieved to realise that there are many ways of hearing truth and that there is probably not one universal test for either prophets or teachers.
That notion of "something in the air" as a setting for teaching or preaching is quite a complex notion that communicators and advertising types analyse endlessly. They try to create desire for their message or product. The effect when this has been done particularly well is similar to that when one has "heard the truth". The difference is one of depth and scope.
Some advertisers I believe would love to think they had an ultimate purpose.
Tony, NZ
Date: 17 Jan 2000
Time: 13:25:29
Isn't this story actually terrifying to the people of the first century who actually believed that sin caused demon possession, ans sin caused birth defects, and sin caused physical illnesses, even through generations of people. for this Nazarene Jesus to not only commant evil to leave , but for the evil to listen and follow must have been terrifying for them. He healed people as well which was in essence the physical act of forgiving sins. A more tangeable device than to simply say "son, your sins are forgiven.... just a thought.... AEB...PA
Date: 18 Jan 2000
Time: 13:45:53
oooops sorry about all those spelling errors. AEB...PA
Date: 22 Jan 2000
Time: 02:03:31
This passage allows us to address a subject which is very important: even the evil spirits recognized Christ and believed He was (is) the Son of God. Knowing and believing is not enough...we must ACCEPT Him as our Savior if we are to be saved! Jesu taught with authority, and had (has)authority even over the unclean spirits...what UNCLEAN SPIRITS are we struggling with, that we can offer to Jesus? I know this is VERY basic stuff, but sometimes it is good to get "back to the basics." Just a few early thoughts......
Rev Janet in CNY
Date: 22 Jan 2000
Time: 20:39:20
I heard a talk the other day delivered by a former slave (yes in this day and age) from Africa. In his country it is the custom for white people (he said Arab Mohamedans) to have slaves. Everyone accepts the custom. That got me thinking. I guess in the Koran the practice is not frowned upon. Then I thought, "Neither is it in our Christian Scriptures." (St. Paul's Letter to the Ephesians) Then I thought, "Mohamedans should not follow the Koran literally as their rule of life." Well, neither should Christians. There has to be an authority somewhere...some voice that speaks with authority and says, "Slavery is wrong." Joe from Maine
Date: 23 Jan 2000
Time: 23:07:21
Light cannot enter the room without casting a shadow. The presence of Christ draws forth the negative. Where life is, death lerks! Demonic presence is manifested in the presence of the holy ...
I remember a monk, guest master, at the Abbey of Our Lady of New Melleray in Iowa say that "for every demon in the world, there were seven in the monastery." Holiness draws forth the opposite. One doesn't have to believe in a dualism (God and Satan) to believe that the darkness always seeks to put out the light. Such was the demon in this account - We know who you are, you have come to destory us (You have come to destroy us!!!)
tom in ga
Date: 24 Jan 2000
Time: 03:07:30
Tom, you reminded me of a saying that I heard from the sife of the associate pastor I had when I was going into the seminary. Her saying was, "There's nowhere that Satan works harder than on the steps leading up to the altar." I think that on this Sunday night as I think about what next week's sermon will be, this is a theme worth considering. (I know that in my own life the saying has born some painful fruit.)
Along with that is the encounter itself -- the unclean spirit recognizing Jesus for who he is -- the holy one of God, the one who meets us on those very same steps. Just getting started.
Dave in Iowa
Date: 24 Jan 2000
Time: 14:45:08
Thomas Long in a sermon picks up on the "teaching". He talks about how there is teaching and there is teaching: so often we hear and we hear, our brains are stretched, but sometimes it all comes clear, "aha!" Here there really was freedom in Christ, really was power over evil. it really is true. glad to be back on the lectionary, thanks to you all, rachel
Date: 24 Jan 2000
Time: 15:44:05
As I read this passage, I was thinking aobut my congregation. They went through a few crises before I came here, then things settled down. I thought things were going pretty well, despite small crises every once-in-a-while. We just had our annual meeting yesterday, and our president presented some things that our council had talked about at retreat that included an accusation against the organist. Now everyone will be in an uproar again. There seems to be a need to be in crisis around here!
As I read the text, the first thing I cotice is that the spirit is not said to be a "demon." I think that can get us away from the Exorcist. Rather it is said to be an "unclean spirit." I would think of something "clean" as something that establishes or keps relationship with God, and something "unclean" (trying to think in Biblical terms) as something that disrupts that relationship. Certainly we have an "unclean spirit" among our congregation, something that keeps us from focusing on his work, getting us sidetracked with petty and stupid - even manufactured - crises! For every advance we make in ministry, it seems we take two steps backward. Isn't that an "unclean spirit?"
Jesus speaks with authority to such spirits. In other places, he seems to be able to identify them clearly - that is one of the most difficult tasks we have, I believe: correctly identifying such spirits and "casting them out." They have a way of grasping people and congregations, and often we have trouble letting go of these unclean spirits.
As a counselor, I am aware of how family systems tend to resist change - even change for the better. I find churches even more resistant to change - the "unclean spirits" are almost impossible to cast out! Quite often we end up demonizing people instead, casting a few of them out (or they get rid of us!), and we thing the problem is solved - yet the unclean spirit remains, continuing to plague the congregation.
How can we speak a word of grace, an authoritative word that is strong enough to deal with such spirits? That will certainly be my task this week!
Gary in New Bern
Date: 24 Jan 2000
Time: 16:11:42
Gary in New Bern: Your story about your annual meeting neatly leads into this text. It is important to remember the real enemy is not other people, but Satan at work behind them. SueCan's observation is also correct, the lectionary (and Mark first) has placed this story here intentionally. What is really going on is a conflict between God in Christ and Satan. In Mark's gospel, of course, human beings never figure out who Jesus really is, the Son of God, until after Jesus' death. But from the beginning, the forces of evil know - the demon identifies Jesus as the Holy One of God. Jesus' exorcism here is indeed a foreshadowing of his ultimate victory in the resurrection. This is not easy stuff to preach in a rationalistic world but I am sure we need to be talking about what is spiritually real. I'm just starting to think about how I'm going to do this myself. Mike in Maryland
Date: 24 Jan 2000
Time: 16:27:10
Thanks for getting the ideas flowing, everyone. I especially liked Gary from New Bern's reminder that we're talking about unclean spirits here. And don't we all have a little dirty laundry in our lives to take care of. We don't like airing our dirty laundry in public, but from God there is no place to hide. Perhaps public is exactly the place it should be aired, because we first need to acknowledge it before we will be able to repent and receive forgiveness from those we might have offended with the unclean spirit. Just getting started with my thinking while I vacuum and do the laundry. Maybe a title should be "Cleaning House." I've been working at the idea of "call" the past few weeks in my sermons, and it struck me that even the unclean spirit listened when Jesus called. Now THAT's speaking with authority! KAS
Date: 24 Jan 2000
Time: 16:43:44
I think its interesting that the first story of Jesus exercising his public ministry has him exorcising a demon. The story says a few things to me. First, the stakes are high. Jesus is taking on the ulitimate in the forces of chaos, darkness, negativity, anti-God, whatever. How you feel about a personal Satan doesn't really matter, the demon language suggests that Jesus is fighting the worst.
Second, the casting out process serves to liberate the victim. His mind is freed. He can hear, see, and think for himself. All that follows in the Gospel of Mark are new teachings and new thoughts on the nature of God, life, and living. If we are to fully appreciate the words which follow this pericope, our own minds must be free and clear to listen to them. Perhaps we need to have Jesus drive out whatever demons are in us, so we can devote our full attention to the good news he is bringing.
Bob, Pittsburgh
Date: 24 Jan 2000
Time: 19:28:43
Just coming back to the forum after a long hiatus -- I recently read an e-mail about being B.U.S.Y. B eing U nder S atan's Y oke. It talks about all the distractions that are placed into our lives so that we have no time to develop any sort of spiritual life. I think that applies here. We are talking about unclean spirits who name Jesus and this one in Mark 1:21-28 tells those gathered in the synagogue -- don't you know, he (Jesus) is here to destroy us! And the people aren't taken with the fact that the unclean spirit is gone -- but with the way Jesus does away with him - and how he speaks with authority. Sometimes we are like that too - we are so enticed with the authority we have in saying we're Christians -- or with the idea of going to church that we actually fail to let God impact us on any level -- we're so caught up in oh the way the choir sang or oh, the way the preacher spoke or oh, the way the hymns touched me that we really aren't allowing ourselves to open up to God at any level. We worship the worship rather than worshipping God. With a loud voice this demon comes out. With the words "Be silent" Jesus calls him out. And all that were there were amazed. "what have you to do with us, Jesus of Nazareth" - isn't that where a lot of our people are. . . What does Jesus have to do with me? Why should I worship him. Why should I come before him? What does any of this faith stuff have to do with us anyway?
Just some thoughts - L I L
Date: 24 Jan 2000
Time: 19:29:41
Just coming back to the forum after a long hiatus -- I recently read an e-mail about being B.U.S.Y. B eing U nder S atan's Y oke. It talks about all the distractions that are placed into our lives so that we have no time to develop any sort of spiritual life. I think that applies here. We are talking about unclean spirits who name Jesus and this one in Mark 1:21-28 tells those gathered in the synagogue -- don't you know, he (Jesus) is here to destroy us! And the people aren't taken with the fact that the unclean spirit is gone -- but with the way Jesus does away with him - and how he speaks with authority. Sometimes we are like that too - we are so enticed with the authority we have in saying we're Christians -- or with the idea of going to church that we actually fail to let God impact us on any level -- we're so caught up in oh the way the choir sang or oh, the way the preacher spoke or oh, the way the hymns touched me that we really aren't allowing ourselves to open up to God at any level. We worship the worship rather than worshipping God. With a loud voice this demon comes out. With the words "Be silent" Jesus calls him out. And all that were there were amazed. "what have you to do with us, Jesus of Nazareth" - isn't that where a lot of our people are. . . What does Jesus have to do with me? Why should I worship him. Why should I come before him? What does any of this faith stuff have to do with us anyway?
Just some thoughts - L I L
Date: 24 Jan 2000
Time: 20:44:35
The exorcisms protrayed by Holiwood usually presume that spirits are not just unclean or less than whole but are part of a systematic intellegence of evil. Even that champion of this kind of fiction, C,S. Lewis said that he did not believe that evil was part of any great organized netwrork or supreme inteligence. Well let me speak of a more recent work of Holiwood on this subject, Beloved with Opra Winfrey has been panned as a bad film. It does indeed have violence bazaar happenings. But it deals with some very deep human hurts which recieve healing and blessing via the delightful spirit preached by an elderly black woman and a great act of community. It is the faithful act of the community which had been inspired by the black woman's preaching years earlier that finally leads to the exorcism. That exocism looks not like typical Holiwood but like a community acting purely in accordance with the compassion and trust in the name of Jesus that is our tradition. There is a line in there where Opra's character replys, "Its not an evil spirit, just a very sad spirit". Beloved, helped me to have a more realiztic sense of the presence of "Unclean spirits" in our daily lives. So please share with me other thoughts and images that help us see "unclean spirits" in a very human way. Manzel
Date: 24 Jan 2000
Time: 20:44:49
The exorcisms protrayed by Holiwood usually presume that spirits are not just unclean or less than whole but are part of a systematic intellegence of evil. Even that champion of this kind of fiction, C,S. Lewis said that he did not believe that evil was part of any great organized netwrork or supreme inteligence. Well let me speak of a more recent work of Holiwood on this subject, Beloved with Opra Winfrey has been panned as a bad film. It does indeed have violence bazaar happenings. But it deals with some very deep human hurts which recieve healing and blessing via the delightful spirit preached by an elderly black woman and a great act of community. It is the faithful act of the community which had been inspired by the black woman's preaching years earlier that finally leads to the exorcism. That exocism looks not like typical Holiwood but like a community acting purely in accordance with the compassion and trust in the name of Jesus that is our tradition. There is a line in there where Opra's character replys, "Its not an evil spirit, just a very sad spirit". Beloved, helped me to have a more realiztic sense of the presence of "Unclean spirits" in our daily lives. So please share with me other thoughts and images that help us see "unclean spirits" in a very human way. Manzel
Date: 24 Jan 2000
Time: 21:44:42
We have been reading all of Mark every other year in Confirmation. A couple of years ago it lead to a word study of Demon and its varitations. Almost all of the refences come from the gospels. there are only two in all the old testament and 9 in the rest of the new testament but there are 63 in the gospels. mehrke in SD
Date: 25 Jan 2000
Time: 07:10:34
Date:1/24/00 Time:10:55pm pst
This passage sets the stage for all of the battles Jesus will face in his ministry and death. It's interesting that the unclean spirit comes from within the worshiping community. That helps us preachers understand why this can be a tough job sometimes. I just got a call from one of my long time elders who is pretty rational that her daughter and children think they are living in a haunted hous. The daughter (8) thinks she is seeing ghosts and angels in her room. She is having some terrible nightmares and is obviously troubled by them. The family, now a single parent household with lots of history seem to have constelated their fears and anxieties in the supernatural from the dark side. TV and movies have been exploiting this genre for quite awhile now and it would be good to get some theological insight about what we see. Our faith points to a loving God who in Christ has overcome the darkest parts of our reality, whether contrived or material. We need to give credence to peoples fears no matter how fantastic they seem and acknowledge the dark side. I hope to bring out the power and authority of Christ is this story that is especially powerful when he is dealing with principalities and powers of darkness. He came as one without a earthly army but with the power of the Holy Ghost. I could list my own obsessions and preoccupations in order to give my congregation some real life examples of how "unclean spirits "can torment us. I get healed from the world on a regular basis when I come under the authority of Christ. peace, garry SF
Date: 25 Jan 2000
Time: 14:07:14
The lectionary discussion has been really good this week. The following might be better on the discussion site but it since it comes in response to what has been going on here I feel free to post.
This morning I sit bundled up against the cold - not cold as my children are experiencing in North Carolina and Nebraska but it is chilly after our long springlike winter. The discussion on demons and unclean spirits and dualism has made me think about heat and cold. The admission that evil exists does not necessarily imply dualism which by definition polarizes equals against one another. True dualism is not often found in nature and when it is it is usually the other side of the same thing. i.e. the north and south poles of a magnet which if the could get together they would bond into one piece.
In our world we find most "opposites" are really a case of quantity and lack. Evil is not a quantity but a lack. We can conceptualize this by thinking of cold and heat. We speak of cold going to the bone but really what is happening is that heat is leaving us and so we become cold. This is analogous to the action of grace, of goodness, and evil of a lack of grace. C.S. Lewis uses this idea in "The Great Divorce." Hell and its occupants are on a hyperbolic curve to infinite smallness which will end where I can't guess. Is there a place for the emptiness of evil in the new creation? ( This is my perennial question!)
We all know of people who possess an emptiness. The seven "cardinal" sins of Pride, Lust, Sloth, Envy, Gluttony, Anger and Covetousness all speak of lack and emptiness. Love, Hope, Faith, Prudence, Temperance, Courage and Justice are all lacking in part or entirety in these 7 unclean spirits. The obese person sad over being fat consoles and feeds that emptiness by eating more. A person lacking in love, real of imagined tries to fill the void with faceless and nameless sex - and so on.
Holiness = wholeness Evil = lack - evil exists of maybe non exists but is very real as the cold that penetrates to the bone of our souls.
Deke in Texas - Pace et Bene
Date: 25 Jan 2000
Time: 15:22:28
Opening eyes, opening ears! The authorities see the amazing and say, "What is this a new teaching?" It is a marvelous understatement.
The church makes such marvelous understatements. Drake- NC
Date: 25 Jan 2000
Time: 15:38:45
Interesting gospel reading in light of two happenings coming up:
1. My wife will defend her dissertation on Thursday, Jan. 27 at Gallaudet University in Washington DC. (Wonder if the snow up there is going to mess this up!) If so, she will then be the only Deaf person with an earned doctorate in the state of Alabama. Her field is clinical psychology.
2. On February 3, Deaf people and friends from all over the state will meet in Montgomery to protest the lack of mental health services for Deaf people, both inpatient and outpatient. We know of one Deaf man who has been in the state hospital for nine years, without a trial. There are other cases.
So, remember us in these next few days. The gospel reading here is a great comfort and encouragement.
Date: 25 Jan 2000
Time: 18:29:41
This event is a true one from my recent past. I trust you will use it as it is intended, to help you think as the actual event really helped me think.
I received the call as I was leaving to conduct a funeral. A member of my congregation said he had "unwanted visitors" at his home. I advised he politely ask them to leave, but he replied, "But these visitors are green floating things!" He admitted he and some friends had been dabbling in "white magic" and had evidently conjured up something they shouldn’t have. I said I had to leave to do a funeral, but would get back to him soon. As a third year seminary student with a student pastorate, my studies had not taught me what to do in a case like this.
There were three very young children at the home who claimed "monsters" were living in their closets. There were also several high school youth visiting daily who were involved in the experimentation. Several youth and adults saw the "green floating forms."
In consultation with my District Superintendent and professors, I made a plan designed to 1, make the people realize they were spending time on evil rather than good, 2, assure them any possible spirits or demons were defeated and gone and 3, encourage them to spend their time not dealing with darkness but with the Light, Jesus.
I assembled all of the group in a meeting at the reportedly "possessed" home. I began by reading scriptures about demons, especially the one where people cast out demons in the "name of the Jesus of which Paul preached." I told them they were dabbling in bad things, and we did a Communion service praying for forgiveness of our sins. We went on to an anointing with oil and praying for healing of all things by laying on of hands (from the UM Book of Worship.)
I then began an affirmation of faith service right out of the UM hymnal. At the end I took the water and flicked it around the room as usual, and went on to flick it throughout the house and on the porch. When I got to the attic, it was up a set of steps which led to a (horizontal) doorway in the ceiling. I crouched atop the steps, pushed up on the door, as I flicked water into the attic.
A loud, eerie, squeaking sound came flying out of the attic as I lifted the door open and flicked water into the attic. It was extremely scary, until after four repetitions I realized the scary noise was simply a rusty old pulley and counter weight attached to the attic door.
Next, we went back downstairs where I spoke of my recent ongoing fasting and prayer, and told them if there was ever any kind of evil spirits or demons in the home, they were definitely gone now. I preached to them about how they needed to spend time worshipping Jesus with prayer, Bible study, meditation, Holy Communion, worship, spiritual fellowship and a spiritual leader. There was never another hint of evil spirits or demons from the family. Whether they saw something or not, I will never know. But I do know my actions brought peace and calm to several children, youth and adults. Whether the evil spirits are real or imaginary, Jesus is the true Source for peace and joy. Jesus defeats ANY evil spirits, real, imagined, figurative or literal. revup (Yes, it happened.)
Date: 25 Jan 2000
Time: 19:00:00
What does Jesus have to do with unclean spirits? 2 Commands- Be silent and come out. Regardless of our influence from the media, we must acknowledge that the presence of evil and its effects on the lives of God's people is real. Before Jesus goes out into the world he exorcised the unclean spirits from the faith community. Because of the former rabbis teaching that lacked authority, the unclean spirits had taken up residence in God's house. Whenever we are in the synogogue or church we must have authority over these spirits that hold people captive. They sit comfortably in our houses of worship, spirits of division, spirits of lust, spirits of incest, spirits of racism, sexism, zenophobia, broken homes, addictions....Jesus renders them voiceless, (the power to define id the power to control) then homeless. Does the church in this century have authority or do these unclean spirits have power over the people of God?
Date: 25 Jan 2000
Time: 19:01:49
In the full knowledge that Super Bowl Sunday is not (officially, at least) part of the liturgical church year -- and in the full knowledge that many in my congregation will be anticipating the big game (even as we worship) -- and, depending where we place the Rams and Titans on our spectrum of good and evil -- perhaps football, in its combative nature, can serve as a springboard for some of our thoughts about conflict in this scripture passage --as well as a "hook" to get the listener's attention. Any other ideas on this line of thought? ALSO, don't forget the "Soup-er Bowl of Caring," appeal -- www.souperbowl.com for more information. Football fan, Revmar in KS.
Date: 25 Jan 2000
Time: 19:03:23
My sermon title is "When _______ Speaks, Everyone Listens!" This is a take-off from an old commercial about a Wall Street company. Who has authority in our lives? Clinton/Congress? Local government? Parents/family members? Employers? How many people do we obey more or less unquestioningly? Do we obey Jesus as easily? WHOSE voice should we hear? WHOSE is the WORD of authority? Rev Janet in CNY
Date: 25 Jan 2000
Time: 21:05:55
Revmar in KS: Leonard Sweet in the Homiletics sermon for this week uses the Super Bowl theme and this text. It's not my medium so although some in my congregation might enjoy it, it would not be authentic for me. But it might fit you.
Caroline in CT/USA
Date: 25 Jan 2000
Time: 22:55:08
It is through "teaching" this opportunity for "healing" occurs. Is there a relationship between "unclean spirit" and the way we perceive, conceive, and make "meaning" or "meaninglessness" of the world, self, others, and God? It is through the vessels of language, that is, "words", that we enter into active conception of self, others, God, and the world. Language and self-consciousness are dynamically inter-connected. Language belongs not only, nor first to the individual, but to the culture, historical context, and community in which one has been socialized. If we are to receive the "word" in this sacred story, it is imperative for us to revisit the context of the faith community who gives us in good faith this narrative. We need to understand their words in light of their worldview in which physical disease (such as in epilepsy) and the spiritual condition of sin were synonomous. If we can peel the layers of their consciousness back to get to the essential meaning lying within and beneath their words (and worlview), then we are part of the way to the inheritance of this covenant gift in faith. That is we need to not only understand the mythological systems within their language and worldview but just as imperative is the peeling of our own layers of consciousness back so we can realize the way we use language to make meaning. .What was the cultural, historical, and community context out of which this narrative of fiath emerged? What is the cultural, historical, and covenant-community context through which we receive this sacred story of faith? If the sacred presence of the Christ can heal the "unclean spirit" in that "hour", can he not heal the "unclean spirit" in this contemporary "moment"? Are we listening to the Word of God in our covenant communities today (and in our personal lives) in such away that by his "teaching" we are healed? I would suggest that we need to go beyond the cultural "scientism", ,the use of language from a modern worldview, in order to get beneath the artificial split or schizoid split we have imposed upon the Sacred Presence by dividing our world into the physical and the spiritual, the God is not here but there in the remote "other world of the beyond. We "see" and "hear" through language/words/meanings we have been taught formally or by just living/becoming socialized in our culture. But today we can transcend the "frozen" language and worldview into which we have been bred and raised. The old science of the modern worldview was built upon a "dyadic" use of language in which cause-effect determinism eliminated the most important ingredient in meaning-making, i.e., the human being who used the language and made the perception/conception to start with. Today a revolution is occuring in our understanding of language and its relationship to consciousness...and to meaning-making in the ability to "speak" as well as to "hear". Charles S. Peirces work as well as Walker Percy's work proposes a theory of language based upon a "triadid/delta" conception where the human being is not eliminated from the structure inherent in meaning-making in the use of words. This has open a whole new world for philosophy, the arts, science, and most of all theology. Hermeneutics is the key to philosophy, science, the arts in literature and drama, as well as theology. Now the Church, in Biblical scholarship, gave our "world" the giift of this key to language...to interpretation. I believe it would be ironic and tragic if scientist building "bridges of communication" between themselves using hermeneutics, if literary artists like Walker Percy, if philosophers like Jacques Derrida and Martin Heidegger, etc., etc., take the gift of the Church and construct a new worldview capable of making sense out of not only the "world" but the teaching power of Jesus while the "unclean spirit" of non-being (death of being frozen in the past) wipes out our "faith" because we did not have ears to "hear" nor "eyes" to see the Presence and power of Jesus' teaching....which is all about holistic healing of "unclean spirits"....and to think we, like the one in need of healing in the synagogue, have sense to know who he is, the son of God. We do not have to fear the eschatological moment we live in, the present and the dawning future in spite of the radical "change", because it is still the Sacred Presence who comes to teach us and to heal us. I hope we all stand in awe, fear and trembling, when this gospel revelation is witnessed this week
Date: 26 Jan 2000
Time: 00:19:35
A song I happened to come across earlier today, about the "unclean spirit", in "Songs for a Gospel People," #74. Words by Thomas H. Troeger, copyright Oxford University Press:
1. "Silence! frenzied, unclean spirit,"/Cried God's healing, Holy One./"Cease your ranting! flesh can't bear it./Flee as night before the sun."/At Christ's voice the demon trembled,/from its victim madly rushed,/while the crowd that was assembled/stood in wonder, stunned and hushed.
2. Lord, the demons still are thriving/in the grey cells of the mind:/tyrant voices, shrill and driving,/twisted thoughts that grip and bind,/doubts that stir the heart to panic,/fears distorting reason's sight,/guilt that makes our loving frantic,/dreams that cloud the soul with fright.
3. Silence, Lord, the unclean spirit/in our mind and in our heart;/speak your word that, when we hear it,/all our demons shall depart./Clear out thought and calm our feeling,/still the fractured warring soul;/by the power of your healing,/make us faithful, true and whole.
Building on an earlier comment by "Tony, NZ" about Jesus' authority: Mark tells us nothing about the content of the teaching, only about the confidence of the teacher. Jesus’ authority evokes a passionate response from a “man with an unclean spirit,” who addresses him both by name (“Jesus of Nazareth”) and by title (“Holy One of God”). Jesus is able not only to silence the “unclean spirit,” but also to liberate the man from the grip of the “unclean spirit.” Ched Myers (in *Binding the Strong Man*) argues that this exorcism “has everything to do with the struggle between the authority of Jesus and that of the scribes” (pp. 141-2). “The demon in the synagogue becomes the representative of the scribal establishment, whose ‘authority’ undergirds the dominant...social order. Exorcism represents an act of confrontation...in which Jesus asserts [and demonstrates] his alternative authority” (p. 143).
Doug in Riverside
Date: 26 Jan 2000
Time: 00:28:14
What do we make of demons? Is possession still possible in our day? The Old Testament has very little to say about devils - only during the intertestmental period do they begin to thrive! Was Jesus dealing with Satan or the popular piety of people who believed in demons?
What physical or psychological illnessess would relate to this experience? I remember years ago visiting a mental hospital. I was struck by the religious paintings on the wall of one patient: a crucifix, a bleeding Christ, a praying Madonna, stars and sun, etc. It was as though something was both being communicated and at the same time not being said or revealed. Is this the demon in Mark's gospel?
tom in ga
Date: 26 Jan 2000
Time: 01:41:31
Gary in New Bern,
As a counselor familiar with family systems it should be important to note that what appears to be a silly and disruptive behavior may be rooted in some unresolved past conflicts. I have seen this in many of the churches I have served. Out of the 7 appointment I have had I was an "After-Pastor" in 5 of them. Which means that some inappropiate actions have been present in the clergy with lasting effects. These nit picking episodes keep happening. Yes there is evil present at the root, but sometimes conflict is is just delayed consequences. If the anger is out of proportion to the incident, I tend to look beyond the presenting problem. Sometimes it is simply a feeling of powerlessness, or an inability to trust. As i said these are rooted in evil but we must look deeper into the situation.
A W-G rocky coast Me.
Date: 26 Jan 2000
Time: 03:24:56
the reflections on semiotics/language theory...I did not sign off. PaideiaSCO north ga mts
Date: 26 Jan 2000
Time: 04:30:02
25 JAN 00
Seems like there might be something worthwhile in pointing not to some other, obscure, fantastic demon possession but that struggle that we face between good and evil. I'd rather not give ha satan too much press or speech on Sunday, but that may be the necessary prelude to the authority of Christ and our need to claim that authority, cleansing and empowering in our lives. Peter In CA
Date: 26 Jan 2000
Time: 12:57:53
Her it is Wednesday and I am still in the musing stage. A lot of helpful thoughts so far. Somewhere in my readings this week I heard "evil" defined as "that which suck life out of us". Truly those unclean spirits exists today, even (especially) in our churches. Another muse is that of Jesus' authority. To me someone speaks with authority when they tell me what is in his/her heart rather than just in one's head. I have always felt that Jesus spoke from the heart and that made all the difference. Time for a skate on the world's longest skating rink, so I'm off to Ottawa. All work and no play makes Jack and me and others too I suppose, a dull boy. Blessings, Deke of the North
Date: 26 Jan 2000
Time: 16:17:34
WOW ! ! ! !
What a wonderful week of insight, dialogue, and ideas.
My sermon this Sunday is called "Radical Ministry." It is based on both this Mark reading and 1 Corinthians 8:1-13.
One of you mentioned the quote that Satan works hardest on the steps leading to the altar. Another that the healing took place in the midst of the faith community.
I believe it is also noteworthy that this first public act of healing/excorism took place in the synagogue.
William O'Brien writes in the January issue of Sojoruners, "In Mark's text, what is ultimately at stake is 'authority' (1:22, 27). The compassionate act of liberaing a posssessedman is also an assult on a corrupted scribal system. In order to open space for the reign of God, Jeus must liberate his community from the evil spirt of religious hypocrisy. This exorcism is the opening act of Jesus' prophetic challenge to religous authority systems, which culminates in his condmnation of the temple state (chapter 11)."
The lectionary reading from 1 Corinthians also addresses the issue of legalistic power politics that serve as stumbling blocks to genuine relationships with Jesus Christ.
My point is to use the illustration of the pharasees hypcocracy and Paul's concern over using meat offered to idols as illustrations of how 'traditional' ministry takes place.
In contrast, I will offer the example of 'radical ministry' which claims the compassionate authority of Christ as a force of liberation. Liberation from that power of Satan lurking on the steps of our altar.
-----------------------------------
On another note, One of you mentioned the hymn, "Silence, Frenzied, Unclean Spirit." It can also be found in the Chalice Hymnal # 186.
Peace,
DWR
Date: 26 Jan 2000
Time: 16:45:41
Date: Jan. 26 Time: 11:30 a.m.
Just recently discovered this site, and am most grateful for the insights and ideas. Here a a few thoughts that occurred to me.
Last Sunday afternoon my husband and I went to see the movie "The Hurricane" Rubin (Denzel W.) tells his friend Lezras (sp?) who is visitng him in prison: "Hate (evil) put me in here; love will bust me out." Later that evening at the Golden Globe Awards, Denzel accepted his prize with the simple words, "God is love,", relating them very briefly to the real "Hurricane" Carter, standing at his side. Denzel's "speech" was not only a welcome break from all the silliness and gush, but a touching/powerful testimony to the Word. Think I will use this movie and Carter's story as a jumping off point for my message this week, as it has much to say about justice, courage, tenacity and love (grace)in the face of the unclean spirits bombarding us. Also appreciated idea of B.U.S.Y, being under Satan's yoke. Good contrast to Jesus' call to "take my yoke upon you." RAS/NY
Date: 26 Jan 2000
Time: 18:31:22
I was wondering what Mark meant by: he taught them as one having authority AND NOT AS THE SCRIBES? How did the scribes teach? What was different from Jesus? Strange question..PM in KS
Date: 26 Jan 2000
Time: 19:31:15
Caroline in CT/USA: I used to subscribe to Homiletics, but no longer get the journal. If you have time (!!) could you (or anyone else) relate just a few points that Leonard Sweet makes in relating this text (conflicting forces) to the Super Bowl? Just wondering if they are close to what I'm mulling around -- or perhaps a different approach. Thanks to anyone who can help. Revmar
Date: 26 Jan 2000
Time: 20:44:36
BUSY Being Under Satan's Yoke - Sounds like an interesting approach. I found it @ http://www.prophezine.com/search/database/Issue73/is73.10.html Revlunn
Date: 26 Jan 2000
Time: 21:27:37
On that day two important things happened, Jesus went to the synagogue at Capernaum and so did a man possessed by an unclean spirit. I think the exploration of that coincidence is worth working on! J. LeGault
Date: 26 Jan 2000
Time: 22:37:31
26 JAN 00
Brian Stoffregen, Lutheran commentator points out (the admittedly rather obvious): The unclean/evil spirit is in a holy place on a holy day, where it should not be. Indeed, we have some of those inappropriate spirits in our worship place and time... (Brian and my examples): the life-long member who says "No!" to every potentially tranforming change; those pre-occupied with the children who "aren't sitting properly"; the person musing about last night's escapades or--how about--the person in the pulpit obsessed with judgment (see above examples!) rather then giving the hope and power of Jesus Christ?! How (related to above)do we preach--with erudition, ego, deception, or with the authority of our Lord? The finger points at all of us in this text... and the strenght of Jesus Christ jettisons the accusing finger, cleansing and empowering us "to be children of God... and that is what we are." Peter in CA
Date: 27 Jan 2000
Time: 04:21:53
It was an invitation. The kind that is given with much fanfare, extended for everyone to see, but you know, deep in your heart you know, that it is just filling in the squares. An invitation to come and share, to extend a call to serve, to interpret that which we already know, but so often fail to do. And yet, in every invitation rests the possibility, that perhaps, just perhaps, the heart may be broken and the spirit may soar, though I really didn’t believe either would occur. So, I went. Square-filler, “have sermon, will travel,” missionary on the road, cloaked in the armor of a well healed cynicism, assured that my Teflon exterior would well protect a heart too often broken by the disappointing truth of folks who only want to “play church.”
The congregation had outgrown their facility. They were one of the fortunate churches fully supporting two Sunday morning worship services. “The sweet mark of success,” I thought as I entered the building which was surrounded by expensive homes of the exclusive neighborhood. Still, I kept reminding myself, it wasn’t the money. “Remember Nicodemus,” I thought, “confused and yet, strangely open.”
I was to preach both services. The sermons were identical except for two stories which I used to illustrate key points. Both sermons would call the congregation to some point of conflict, to some point of conversion. Yet, in one of the sermons, the stories were more emotional and might be viewed from a point of confrontation. I simply did not believe I would be able to tell them. And even though I knew that God would have me proclaim God’s truth, I delivered the safer sermon. Playing church.
The first service went better than I had expected. Terry, the pastor, actually did not seem terribly offended with the “gentler” sermon. Certainly, more than a few others would have responded with some degree of animosity. I was a bit surprised, for in it, I had called the liturgical life of the contemporary church into question as it related to the reality of our worship in the world. Grudgingly, I admitted to myself that perhaps my cynicism was misplaced. Grudgingly. As he shook my hand on the way to Sunday School, I thought, “Well here is a real guy. Here is a brother who has moved beyond the games.” Hopeful, I entered the classroom.
The lesson was from the book of Luke, the story of the hemorrhaging woman. Though the teacher sought class participation, the discussion was less than animated. Finally, for a few moments, one fellow spoke of the Jewish purity laws, but with little additional perspective from others in the class, the teacher sought to move to the next bit of text. However, I suggested that we talk about this a bit more. I offered up a picture of how I understood being ostracized by the community might look during that time and at that place. Then I suggested that this story was a story for us today. Finally, I asked, “Who might those folks be in our realm?” Nobody said anything. So clearing his throat, Mike, the teacher, began to speak. Abruptly, out of the corner, a small voice swept over the room, “That would be me.” Suzanne, the beautiful Spirit of God.
She then went on to talk about being a child of the sixties and of being very wealthy. She traveled to England and there, she met her husband, Edward, who was sitting next to her. She told of finding Jesus, of “being saved.” She spoke of leaving a life of drugs and sex and money, of walking away from an existence of party and promiscuity. She spoke of returning to America, of hearing the call of God to proclaim God’s word and be God’s presence on the street. And then, Suzanne talked of being rejected, fully and completely. She said that most churches were not very accepting of them – two wild looking ex-hippies working with addicts. “Surely,” I thought, “she must be joking.” Why would she have ever thought differently?
She spoke of being cut off from the community, of discovering the harsh realities of loneliness, homelessness, hunger. Yet, God was generous, and after years of struggle, she stated that they had found their “ministerial niche” and had, after all, garnered some acceptance from the community of the contemporary church.
I was overwhelmed and talked with them more after the class. She said that now their home was open to indigent travelers and other folks who needed “short-term” shelter. They offered sanctuary for battered women and “wounded pastors.” When I asked her what was a wounded pastor, she snapped, “You know! Wounded pastors! Those who have been eaten alive by their congregations and then thrown out on the refuse pile.” “You know!” she harshly proclaimed as she stared into my eyes. “They come to us for healing and recovery.” And then more gently, “You know.”
I was so buoyed by their indomitable spirit, that I decided to go with the more emotional stories during the second and primary worship service. I decided that I could do it after all. So I preached them.
Sometimes we believe that God’s Spirit is presence, and so the Spirit is. Sometimes, we believe that we might feel the gentle brush of the Spirit’s breath, and so we might. Sometimes, at a time when we might not even expect it, God will ease into our midst and we will know, that truly God is here. But rarely, does God blow through like a hurricane, whipping all who go before the Spirit’s wind, turning our well planned order into the chaos where hearts skip a beat and our carefully crafted images of reality are shattered. This, was such a time.
I was overwhelmed by the response from the congregation. People were crying throughout the church. As I preached, there in the fourth row was Suzanne, her head on her hands and her eyes closed, praying! Praying with passion and praying with conviction. Praying that God would move Her people, praying that God would transform Her church. Overwhelmed. I was completely overwhelmed.
When I finished, Terry took my place in the pulpit, giving me a very tight smile, or maybe it was a grimace. He then stated that now was the time when we shared our joys and concerns. He looked more than a bit uncomfortable as he quickly chirped, “Is there anyone who has any praises?!! Certainly, someone has some praises. Does anyone have a birthday!!” Finally, someone from the back of the church said, “Well, Debbie has a birthday today.” And, Terry said, “Great! Its Debbie’s birthday! Does anyone else have a birthday?” Then someone up front said, “Well, its my wife, Denise’s, birthday.” Again, Terry responded, “That’s wonderful!” Does, anyone else have praises??!!”
Now during this time, I was sitting there thinking, “Oh my God, he is going to ignore what has happened here. He is going to move right by the presence of the Spirit like the Spirit had never come. Oh my God.” I was about to sink into despair when suddenly a voice came from the fourth row—“I have a praise.” Slowly Suzanne rose from her seat. “I want to praise God that the Spirit of the Lord is in our midst.”
She then called out, “How long are we going to be a people who do not hear the cries of anguish beyond our walls? How long are we going to allow folks to live in squalor? How long are we going to allow our elderly suffer in quiet misery?! How long are we going to allow our children to fall into the horrible nightmare of drug addiction and self-mutilation?!! How long are we going to sit here and offer each other sweet platitudes as our neighbors suffer?!!!”
And she went on and on...”How long...How long...How long...How long?!!!!!” Her voice got louder and louder and louder until she was almost wailing. “How loooonnngggg!!!!!!!” I thought I was going to shout for joy!!! Here was Suzanne, rejected and now healed! Here was Suzanne, purified and holy! Here was Suzanne, a voice uplifted in truth, a voice uplifted with authority, a voice stilling the noise of the demonic. The voice of the fool, baffling the wise, and chastising the unclean. God’s own fool.
Then she cried, “Pastor, I thank you for your teaching on the Holy Spirit and now, I thank God that today, we have heard the prophetic word. WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO!!????”
And with that, she was quiet. Everyone sat in silence, stunned. Everyone sat waiting, waiting for a response. You could feel presence of God’s Spirit, pressing down on us. It was palatable, a concrete presence of the Word made Flesh. By this time I was in tears. It was remarkable!!! It was the most remarkable single event I have ever witnessed in a worship service. I wondered, “My Lord, what will be next?” I hardly breathed!!
When suddenly Terry turned to the choir and said, “Mike, Mike, you have a birthday don’t you????!! Are there anymore praises??? Anyone???”
After a moment, Mike said, “Yes it is my birthday,” and just like that, the congregation moved back into their proper roles and it was if nothing had ever happened, as if God had not visited this place at all.
After the service, Suzanne and Edward joined me on the steps and we came together, embracing the other, each clutching the other in the grip of life. I urgently whispered, “Keep the faith, Sister Suzanne, keep the faith.” With a slow but knowing smile, she responded, “This thing is not over...Jesus is alive!”
Wow.
Shalom my friends, Nail-Bender in NC
PS - Sorry if this posted more than once. I had some difficulty with the submission.
Date: 27 Jan 2000
Time: 08:12:24
Been a while since I posted. But, as with everyone else, I truly enjoy lurking.
Some thoughts:
A pastor friend was once asked if he believed in demons. He responded: "I don't believe IN demons...but I see them everyday.
In the film "Jacob's Ladder," which I saw at least 10 years ago, there is a line from the mysic, Meister Eckhardt. It went something like: "You know that you are growing closer to understanding God when you realize the that the demons who were pursuing you were angels all along." When we are filled with evil spirit, when our faces become contorted in anger at one another, when we are hurt and aim to hurt, the presence of Christ in our midst appears to have "come to destroy us." But, instead of demons coming to destroy us, we are faced with Christ coming to save us.
This can tie in with those struggling with change, with pastors struggling with criticism from their members, with members rebelling against pastoral guidance. What looks evil may be the holiness of God.
Jim in Alaska
Date: 27 Jan 2000
Time: 13:45:04
JG in WI to PM in KS
The scribes and rabbis usually taught from what other rabbis and commentators said. "This is what the scriptures say. And about that, rabbi 'so-and-so' says this." Or they'd quote the Talmud or Targum or other books of commentary. It's the same way for us when we quote Luther, or Spurgeon, thinking that, by quoting someone great, it gives greater credence and credibility to what we say. Jesus, however, spoke by His own authority. "You have heard it said ... but I say..."
Hope that's an answer to your question. God bless.
Date: 27 Jan 2000
Time: 13:53:06
JG in WI again
Just thought I'd add where I'm going with this passage.
I note that twice the passage mentions the reactions of the people. In 1:22, "They were astounded at his teaching..." and in 1:27 "They were all amazed..." They reacted strongly, but the key is that they were not converted. In Matthew 18:23-24, Jesus speaks of judgment on Capernaum because they did not repent (see the context and Luke 10:13). Jesus doesn't want us to be in awe, but He calls us to repent (last week's gospel reading) and believe the good news.
Hope this is helpful. God bless.
Date: 27 Jan 2000
Time: 23:23:20
The Super Bowl of Authority
Isn't it true that people enjoy seeing contests of good and evil, where good wins? Some examples might be World Wrestling? People cheer for the good, boo for the bad. People used to enjoy seeing westerns on TV. The good guys in the white hats, the bad in the black hats. Isn't Jesus the good guy and the demons, the bad? Those standing on the side wanted and needed to see the battle. Another thought - do we need to name our demons before we can overcome them - i.e. addiction, revenge, greed,etc.? Then we are freed to overcome them.
Date: 27 Jan 2000
Time: 23:44:46
"What have you to do with us?" In the shadow parts of our lives--in the gap between our personal lifestyles and the Spirit of Jesus--there are "unclean spirits" that we protect from confrontation with Jesus as with the question, "What has this to do with you, Jesus?" Bob in MO
Date: 28 Jan 2000
Time: 01:03:35
We think, don't we, that the man with the demon had multiple personality disorder? He was was not like me or you. Not at all. Jesus came to take care of the truly and terribly messed up and set them right. But us? What, after all, is wrong with us? We, after all, follow him. Pehaps we confess our sins and take communion or head to the altar. We after all, have no demons, do we? If we did, we would see a shrink, n'est pas?
In the holy places, those intersections between ordinary and sacred, could it be our demons accompany us? Are they legion? Strong, weak, socially acceptable or unfit for the public? Perhaps this is a time to allow God to surface in our hearts just one of those demons, that it might be handed over.... Or we could assure ourselves that unclean spirits are the work of shrinks alone.
HW in HI
Date: 28 Jan 2000
Time: 17:54:00
. . .Just a thought, Martin luther had a struggle with those evil forces behind the castle walls. For him the demonic presence was a very real presence of evil, piercing the darkness. Yet Luther knew very well that one little subdues him. As you prepare to write your messages I encourage you to use the words of Luther's "A Mighty Fortress is our God" for a devotion.
Dan in IL.
Date: 28 Jan 2000
Time: 18:03:38
. . .Just a thought, Martin Luther had a struggle with those evil forces behind the castle walls. For him the demonic presence was a very real presence of evil, piercing the darkness. Yet Luther knew very well that because our Champion came to fight and win the victory for us, now one little subdues him. As you prepare to write your messages I encourage you to use the words of Luther's "A Mighty Fortress is our God" for a devotion.
Dan in IL.
Date: 28 Jan 2000
Time: 18:57:53
I was struck by some of the talk this week about FAMILY SYSTEMS THEORY and ANNUAL MEETINGS.
Last week at our annual meeting a fellow "blew up", yelled and ranted, tried to dominate everyone, and it caused great discomfort for all present.
Being a student of FAMILY SYSTEMS, I remembered that "the issue is not the issue. The process is the issue", so I said calmly "Joe, it would really help us all a lot if you would just make your opinions KNOWN". He burst out laughing, admitted he was a jackass even at union meetings...
......and the whole congregation was AMAZED.....
...they said so to me afterward...amazing...amazing.
I couldn't help but think of it when I sat down this week and looked at the text. Not that I want to compare myself to the Lord...but TEACHING WON THE DAY!!! (Yes?) Not that Family Systems is the Word, but LOVE is, and love what what I demonstrated, in the name of Jesus of Nazareth.
"Joe" did not recognize him, however. Neither did a lot of other people. I did
(I can't use this in my sermon -- too close to home -- hope it helps someone else)
Rev. Anna from British Columbia United Church of Canada
Date: 28 Jan 2000
Time: 19:05:01
yo ho ho
Date: 28 Jan 2000
Time: 20:45:16
Curious perhaps that it is the unclean spirit, minion of the deceiver, who tells the truth. BAJ
Date: 28 Jan 2000
Time: 21:53:25
Following the comment from BAJ. Yes the demons do know who Jesus is. To look at the text from a literary perspective, who is the 'authentic voice'. It is the voice of the Father at the Baptism and Transfiguation of Jesus.
Another point:It's intersting that a number of submissions this week show how much of our mental imagery is led by film texts. (I wonder how first century imagination worked.) Perhaps we create fear unnecessarily. One of the main reasons I have not seen the film the Excorcist (other than the fact I get the heebeegeebees watching horror films)is that I do not want the mental imagery. I want to be free from that particular prison.
It also shows how contempory entertainment can lead our thoughts as we embrace scripture rather than thelogical exploration (Something of which I am guilty!) I know cimena and TV can be illustrative, but I think the Christian task is to transform this area of life rather than be led by it.
Gooders in Edinburgh
Date: 29 Jan 2000
Time: 03:04:27
The trouble with Hollywood’s depiction of evil is that too often the human agent is a hapless pawn while in reality it is the hearts and minds of humans that engage in and indeed celebrate the most vile and despicable acts of depravity. But before we pass those acts off on serial killers we must first acknowledge that on Sunday AM within liturgical circles “We confess that we are in bondage to sin and cannot free ourselves…” We are all possessed. And so we see Jesus coming towards us and cry out “Have you come to destroy us?” “No.” says the Christ. “I have come that they might have life and have it more abundantly.” I am exorcised every day when I remember my Baptismal covenant. I reject the forces of evil, the devil and all his empty promises. And I confess that I believe in God the Father, in Jesus Christ the Son of God and in God the Holy Spirit. The next five Sunday’s the lectionary gifts us with the stories of Jesus’ healing ministry beginning with the casting out of all that is not of God. Let us then confess our sins to one who has come not to destroy us but to save those who call upon his name. And as often as possible let us endeavor to speak well of those who even bother to gather on Sunday AM even if they come to celebrate birthdays. I preached the circuit for a time and found it much easier than living week in and week out with sinners who sit on my church council – but who am I – chief of sinners though I be… Rev. Phil in TX
Date: 29 Jan 2000
Time: 13:47:09
Don't get hung up on the "unclean spirit". This passage is about Jesus teaching with authority, speaking with authority. The "unclean spirit' is an example in Mark's construction. We need to ask ourselves, what is the the new teaching? That is what people need to hear.
Hugh Mathreson in Gaspé Quebec
Date: 29 Jan 2000
Time: 13:47:25
Don't get hung up on the "unclean spirit". This passage is about Jesus teaching with authority, speaking with authority. The "unclean spirit' is an example in Mark's construction. We need to ask ourselves, what is the the new teaching? That is what people need to hear.
Hugh Mathreson in Gaspé Quebec
Date: 29 Jan 2000
Time: 14:25:46
How do the scribes teach? I suspect much like we do, working from the text, and drawing from that text a message for the current day. They were people of the book, so how else? Jesus' approach is different, but I doubt that we could emulate it, because our authority comes from our knowledge of a book too. Any one who tried to teach in such a manner: "You have heard Jesus say...BUT I say to you..." would not have a pastorate for long. Let's face it, we are scribes. even thte word cleric comes form the english word for scribe: clerk
Raising dust where ever I go. Hugh in Gaspé, Quebec
Date: 29 Jan 2000
Time: 14:32:37
To Dan (and all of course) I rad somewhere that in Luther's hymn that he had a subliminal (or maybe not so subtle) message with the phrase "with one small word". The author suggested that Luther was referring to his disagreements with the Church of Rome and the prince of ill being the pope and one small word being "faith". Not much to preach from here unless maybe the unclean spirit of sarcasm of Luther being present in the church???? Deke of the North.
Date: 29 Jan 2000
Time: 14:45:41
To RASNY Thank you so much for your contribution regarding "The Hurricane" I went to see it last night. It is a truly powerful film but I would guess it's true power comes from the lives that were really lived. The transforming power of God's love and the Truth's of our hidden evil hearts were a blessing to my spirit. Truth frees. Agape, -Fisherfolk in OH
Date: 29 Jan 2000
Time: 15:25:51
Thank you nail bender-- we who have responsibnility in worship need to be reminded that it isn't our role to keep everything in order....now for the praises and birthdays....
in a culture of the mainstream, where the bulletin dictates that we will respond to the "Breaking Open of the Word" only within 59 1/2 minutes.... it is no wonder that the demons don't have to wait outside the sanctuary door..... How often we are pushed on through a religious event because it is written on the printed page, and WE HAVE TO FINISH THE ASSIGNMENT. And we must not lose control of our feelings,emotions, expressions and the clock....
dps is so helpful.... and appreciate the positive and helpful responses.... I went back a year and can see the contrast....gone are the coarse, negative, hurtful responses...... what happened? authority of Jesus?
donhoff elmira, NY donaldhoff@aol.com
Date: 29 Jan 2000
Time: 15:39:02
I am blessed to have in our congregation a retired minister who loves to participate and help! He happens to be liturgist for this Sunday. So when I am reading the gospel, he's going to shout from the back: "What have you to do with us, Jesus...?" I will continue: But Jesus rebuked him, saying, --and then a soloist will sing the first verse of Silence, Frenzied Unclean Spirit. I will preach the sermon on confronting the evil in our hearts, and then the congregation will sing the last two stanzas of Silence..." It should be electric. I pray the Spirit will speak to many. Clare in Iowa
Date: 29 Jan 2000
Time: 16:05:23
The unclean spirit cried out, "Have you come to destroy us?" This seems important to me, for the answer which is unsaid.
YES!! This is why Jesus came. To destroy the unclean spirits, and their hold on those who are beloved by God.
Whether the unclean spirit is some depraved spiritual creature, or simply represents the depravity within us that we have not yet yielded to God's control, Jesus has come to release us from the terrible effects of such a spirit.
Isn't it a wondrous mystery that the authority which makes such spirits obey, brings us such liberty!
Chris in W VA
Date: 29 Jan 2000
Time: 16:24:24
I am struck by the similarities between Paul's Epistle and this Gospel.
One story takes place in a pagan temple, another in the synagogue, the house of God.
One story speaks of the demonic in terms of an unclean spirit possessing a man
The other story speaks of a demonic spirit that would eat with liberty the food sacrificed to gods in the presence of those who are new to the faith.
The man who eats the unclean food is greedy and unwilling to respect the spiritual condition of the other; The man with an unclean spirit seeks to control Jesus by "naming him" - you are the holy One of God. Both Jesus and Paul seek to exorcises this demon of control.
tom in ga
PS - its a little icy in north Georgia - don't know yet whether we will have church in the morning.
Date: 29 Jan 2000
Time: 17:39:48
I was interested to discover the chiastic structure of this passage: The first verse is parallel to the last. The second is parallel to the second last and so on. The very middle of the pericope, which would seem to be greatly emphasized by this structure is "Have you come to destroy us?' spoken by the evil spirits, which I think represent the old way of the scribes, the ones opposing new possibilities and new authority.
Date: 29 Jan 2000
Time: 18:45:40
To Nail Bender in NC: thanks for that GREAT account of a special Sunday morning!
Bill in TN (go Titans!)
Date: 29 Jan 2000
Time: 18:47:36
to Nail Bender in N.C.: thanks for that GREAT account of a special Sunday morning!
Bill in TN (go Titans!)
Date: 30 Jan 2000
Time: 00:37:05
Tommy Tenney in "The God Chasers" suggests that Jesus is not welcome in many of our churches. We are more confortable with the distance we have from God and with the control we have over Him. If Jesus should come to our church this Sunday we might be in for a surprise. The unclean spirits with whom we have either made peace or have not recognized will be first to recognize the presence of the clean and righteous God.
God will not have anything unclean in His presence and when sin faces the righteous God there is going to be some dying. Just ask Jesus. Evil will be cast out when Jesus is let in. He will do what we cannot do in most of churches--- get rid of the evil or unclean spirit.
It's time we invited Jesus to come and teach and be open to the change that can come over us.
I think there are two kinds of people staying away from church today. Those who know the Lord is not in our synagogues/churches and those who are afraid He might be there and are afraid to face Him because it might mean feeling what happens the when we come before a clean and righteous God. Something in us must die in order that we might be free from what is keeping us from life.
Date: 30 Jan 2000
Time: 02:46:08
Just a thought - Nailbender's pastor friend who wouldn't let the Spirit speak and moved to restore order . . and Jesus restoring order and propriety in the synagogue by silencing unruly utterances . . interesting contrast.
I pray, as do many of us, I suppose, for the gift of discernment . . to be able to recognize the Spirit, and to differentiate what is the voice of the Spirit Holy, and what is the voice of our own watered-down sentimentality and sugared-up entertainment in worship. I don't know that I will ever have that gift. Are you saying that somehow bulletin-printed worship that follows a proscribed order is a confinement for God's Spirit? I thought the Spirit was stronger, more creative than that. And is the evidence of strong emotion in a worship service always evidence of God? kbc in sc
Date: 30 Jan 2000
Time: 04:08:53
KBC
you wrote <<Are you saying that somehow bulletin-printed worship that follows a proscribed order is a confinement for God's Spirit? I thought the Spirit was stronger, more creative than that. And is the evidence of strong emotion in a worship service always evidence of God? kbc in sc>>
Yes you got it ..... I believe that we can make our worship time so prescribed, so predictable.... that the Spirit Holy is restrained... and we are bullet-proof and bulletin-proofed.... I've seen congregations which were freed and loosened.... get a frosty chill and curl up.... it isn't the power of Satan at work, nor a devil or unclean spirit.... it is plain encouragement in a head on collision meeting with discouragement. I did a study of new churches, growing churches and find that they more often than not do not use bulletins. We use bulletins as a resource page.... wonder what not using bulletins or only as a guide would do with congregations with troubled spirits.
donhugginghisbulletinasking"anybirthdays?"
donhoff elmira, ny
Date: 30 Jan 2000
Time: 04:17:20
Two interesting contrasts here - one stated and the other implied. There is the issue of Jesus authority and the lack of authority of the scribes, who kept quoting other religious leaders, on which they would base their opinions about the law. In contrast, Jesus told stories (we are not told which ones he told at this event) which bore the unmistakable mark of the Gospel. Preachers have to always be careful about that. Our people don't care what everyone else said - they want to know whether we have a word of God for them!
The other is the matter of the "unclean spirit," which contrasts to the "clean spirit" of Jesus. Cleanliness had to do with relationship, both with God and with one another. That which disrupted the relationship with God was "unclean," whether it had to do with birth and death laws, Sabbath observance, mental illness, etc. Jesus frees the man from his unclean spirit, restoring him both to God and the community. Only the spirit of God can overcome "unclean spirits" in our midst. Eucharist proclaims that spirit's presence among us. This test is a strong introduction to Eucharistic understandings of the church and its healing ministry!
Gary in New Bern
Date: 30 Jan 2000
Time: 14:50:16
I know it's late, but I haven't been here in a long time and thought I'd "cruise the comments" before finishing things off.
The thought occured to me this week that authority is not rooted in WHO you are, but in WHOSE you are. Jesus confirmed this with some visits to the wilderness (Grk.=eramos) - to visit with God? WHOSE are we in this world? (to use bad English)
Date: 30 Jan 2000
Time: 14:52:36
Sorry about not signing off. One last thought - while both may be confrontive - the authority of Christ frees while the authority of the devil binds. Don in Colorado
Date: 31 Jan 2000
Time: 04:03:57
short and sweet and a bit late. it seems to me that the unclean spirit knows who he is . but what realy stands out to me is that the crowd didn't know him for who he is but for what he did. Roger from west virginia.
Date: 27 Jan 2001
Time: 06:53:27
I was just listening to a audio tape by a priest and he mentioned that the catholic church, had just approved a new addition of a prayer book called:
1999 revised Rite of Excorism. Does anyone know the publisher name, address, phone and order information. Please send to: rloblock@aol.com I am not on this email group list so please email me, thank you.