Date: 27 Mar 2000
Time: 05:46:45
Janice, I thought about a true story that you might be able to use. I had a member (call him Bill) who needed a heart transplant. His own heart became so bad that he could no longer leave the hospital but instead was hooked to this machine which pumped his blood and kept him alive. It was big and bulky and weighed about as much as a small refrigerator. Everywhere Bill went in the hospital, someone else had to come along and tow this big machine. Then one day he received the transplant, he lost the big machine, he was free to go home with his family. he is now back at work and can play with his young children. It seems to me that to write the covenant on our hearts is a bit like all of this. The Law was written on the big bulky tablets of stone. Then interpretations that were made created a bulky set of laws too heavy. God wants to set us free, so he says, I'll give them a heart transplant and write my law in their hearts. Joy
Date: 28 Mar 2000
Time: 21:41:40
Dear friends,
Is this text not about the glory of transformation for Christ's sake? And the way in which we are humanly troubled by our fear of same...?
Can this approach lead to a sermon path (I hope)...? I imagine that many of us, and our parishioners, have felt that we would rather NOT serve, that we'd rather NOT follow. It's too painful. It's too risky. It's too much...
But Jesus pointed out that we must die to our old selves so that we can live in newness of life...
I'm looking for ways that this can this be illustrated so that parishioners can relate to the text. It's such a great way to prepare ourselves for the following week's readings re the Palm Sunday Passion. A forerunner of things to come.
But will people hear??
JFC in NH
Date: 29 Mar 2000
Time: 03:55:16
oops, the heart transplant story was supposed to go to a comment with the Jeremiah text. Joy
Date: 29 Mar 2000
Time: 12:48:26
I'm focusing on "seeing" Jesus: our similarities to the Greeks who wanted to see Jesus, wanted to see more God whereas the Jews wanted to see more power. (I want to see, not proof or power but affirmation, acceptence, direction (almost more Jesus & less God.) And how Jesus tells the Greeks how they will see him: 24, in his death; 25, when we loose our life for his sake; 26, when we serve; 27, when we obey; 28, when we glorify God.Then there's a piece on judgement. I'm not sure how that fits in. Any comments? - Linda in MD
Date: 29 Mar 2000
Time: 12:53:53
I'm focusing on "seeing" Jesus: our similarities to the Greeks who wanted to see Jesus, wanted to see more God whereas the Jews wanted to see more power. (I want to see, not proof or power but affirmation, acceptence, direction (almost more Jesus & less God.) And how Jesus tells the Greeks how they will see him: 24, in his death; 25, when we loose our life for his sake; 26, when we serve; 27, when we obey; 28, when we glorify God.Then there's a piece on judgement. I'm not sure how that fits in. Any comments? - Linda in MD
Date: 01 Apr 2000
Time: 00:06:37
JFC I like your idea for a sermon I think it could go far. I have lived an experience that may be helpful. I became a Christian in my teens but never dealt with some of my old ways, got married and wanted desperately to have children. For more than 10 years nothing happened. When I started to deal with the old self and some sins in my life then the new self in Christ came to life and some fantastic healings happened in my life. I needed to loose my life in order to gain the life Christ intended for me. The miracle in the story is that after 13 years of prayer and changing to be more Christ like we are expecting our first child. I beleive it is because I began to honor the father that he choose to honor us with a child. Serving God I always did but following his guidance ( getting rid of a particular sin) was much harder and in the end I had to follow knowing it was what was best for me and for my relationship with God. Hope this helps.
Date: 01 Apr 2000
Time: 04:16:53
The approach of the Greeks is a renewal of the temptation to Jesus to avoid the cross. Those He has primarily preached to - Israel - continue to reject Him and his message. Here now are Greeks apparently inquiring after J. - of whose actions and words they have no doubt heard something - in an open and welcoming spirit. Why not turn away from Israel and go direct to the nations? With the apparent responsiveness of the Greeks, perhaps rejection and a cross won't be necessary in order to win them over to the kingdom of God. This is just as in the first temptation, when the Devil lifted J. up to the mountain top and said, "Here are all the nations of the earth - I can give them to you without you needing to submit to the will of God to undergo the cross".
But...accepting this path would have amounted to submitting to the lordship of Evil - “...if you but bow down and worship me”. In order for there to be any mission of God to the nations there first had to be the cross/death of the Son of God - in its unity of course with the resurrection/ascension. The event had to take place where the failure of the whole world, and its consequent estrangement from God, was resolved and overcome. If J. had avoided the cross, all of this would have been lost. So, at this point of the history of revelation, J. ignores the approach of the Greeks, and says resolutely that His path must lie in the way of the cross/death - ie. that His ministry must remain focussed on Israel who will continue to reject Him, and crucify Him.
The Church is continually tempted to go direct to the “Greeks” - the nations, the world outside the Church - without raising the whole matter of the cross/death of Christ. Our Western Church is very much focussed on “market” analysis in these days. We try hard to identify what society wants - what appeals to it, what “sells”, and then develop strategies and “product” that will supply these demands. Funnily enough, the cross and death are not in big demand in the market place! Society does not naturally wish to be confronted with issues raised by Jesus’ death: our failure and sin - both individual and corporate - that necessitated it; God’s judgement upon our failure and sin expressed in it; God’s sovereign grace for us working in it to totally forgive and reconcile us to Him and one another that totally obligates us to Him - no allowance for human autonomy here!; the free and full and joyful repentance it commands in us.
We may appeal to the world, we may attract the world, we might “stuff” our Churches full without raising the whole matter of Jesus’ cross and death, but will we have actually carried out God’s mission to them? Will we have given them a full, living relationship with the only true life itself - the Father, the fons divinitatus? Will we have given them anything different from what they already had, although perhaps with a bit of a religious dress? If we have had “mission” to the world that does not include embracing the cross of Christ - all of its meaning in all of its depth - and living out its truth, then we’ve led no one to a genuine relationship with Christ - Jn 12:25,26.
Jonathan.
Date: 02 Apr 2000
Time: 17:33:45
To Linda in MD A comment-The judgement of this world could not come until there was a choice. The Law condemned but until the price was paid and a choice could be made there could be no just judgement. God provided the payment; the blood of his only Son. God gives us the choice ...... we comdemn ourselves by not believeing on the one God sent. God tells us to choose life. Jesus says, "I am the way, the truth, and the live." LPinPA
Date: 02 Apr 2000
Time: 17:55:43
Date: 2 April Time: 15:05:45
Comment I'm looking ahead to our Youth Sunday and want to find a poem called "Chosen" by Jim McEachon - name may be misspelled. Any one who can help? Thanks Lee in Michigan
Date: 03 Apr 2000
Time: 01:10:21
"Now my soul is troubled. And what should I say--' Father, save me from this hour'? No, it is for this reason that I have come to this hour." To me, this verse speaks of the importance of Jesus following God's perfect will instead of our own imperfect wills. Does this mean we too need to follow God's will rather than our own? It is a difficult challenge. Does anyone else see this here in verse 27? revup
Date: 03 Apr 2000
Time: 02:16:58
Revup Yes, and it is a struggle for me - at least when i am spiritually "Intune". Other time - most of the time - I simply follow my wisdom and then wonder why God does not use me in more spectacular ways.
It resonates for me with the script that says "There is a way that seems right to a man . . ." I beleive it doesn't end well for thise of us who seek our own wisdom and comfort.
Much to think about here.
Pastor Bill in upstate NY
Date: 03 Apr 2000
Time: 10:09:40
12:24 Very truly, I tell you, unless a grain of wheat falls into the earth and dies, it remains just a single grain; but if it dies, it bears much fruit. Sometimes a church structure must die before much fruit comes. A church building becomes the idol... and people struggles to keep the large empty structure heated in winter. Now I know why God wants to live in peoples hearts. They are moveable sanctuaries. Able to go into all the world and preach the Gospel. When the building becomes more important than the message something is wrong. I pray to God he helps us see who and what the true Church is and then gives us the strength to act upon truth. What is more loving to keep a building open which saps the strength of the people, who for some misguided loyalty stay, or to close the building and let the people find another body of Christ which is active and vibrant. Just by thoughts... and perhaps a prayer to guide all in authority who know more than I. LPinPA
Date: 03 Apr 2000
Time: 14:28:16
Thanks, Jonathan, for getting me started. The question of the Greeks was the first thing that popped out at me. Debra in NYC
Date: 03 Apr 2000
Time: 15:12:46
LPinPA: I had a student pastorate that was receiving subsidies. I felt and kindly told them any church that could not support itself and needed outside help was doomed. If a church cannot support or even try to work at helping others missionally, it should close so the members can find a loving, giving church that focuses on others instead of themselves. Of course, there are churches that are missions to the underpriviledged, but they too need to grow to a point they can eventually focus on helping others themselves.
revup (PS: That church listened and is helping others and paying their own bills, the last I heard.)
Date: 03 Apr 2000
Time: 15:43:05
"12:32 And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself." 12:33 He said this to indicate the kind of death he was to die."
Did he also say it to indicate what kind of life WE are to live? If we are called to be Christ's Body in the world, is it not our task to "draw all people" to the saving grace of God in Christ Jesus? Ands what do we have to show those who come to us, asking as the Greeks did, "Sir, we wish to see Jesus?" What Jesus will they see in us? Early musings on a beautiful spring Monday! Shalom, Susan in SanPedro
Date: 03 Apr 2000
Time: 15:45:05
A true story, told to me by one of our members here in Raleigh. Please forgive me for the length.
Few places in a hospital are as emotionally gut-wrenching as the waiting room of a children's hospital. Parents are there facing their worst fears - the health and safety of their own children. What is remarkable is how quickly the various sets of parents that find themselves in the waiting rooms begin to bond with each other.
A family here found themselves in the waiting room of WakeMed after their son Alex quickly became seriously ill in the middle of the night. All sorts of tests were being administered to him, and they could do nothing else but to sit and wait. While there in the waiting room, they found themselves sitting by another family - they were there because their teenage daughter Karen had been in a car accident.
Alex's parents and Karen parents bonded quickly, supporting each other in their angst of not knowing whether or not their children were going to live through the night. After several hours, Karen's parents were called out to a seperate room where they were given the news that her injuries were too severe and there was nothing else they could do for her. Almost unbelievably, in the middle of their grief they made the effort to go back into the waiting room to thank Alex's parents for their support and shared their prayers for his health before they left the hospital.
An hour or so later, Alex's doctors came into the waiting room to tell his parents that they his condition had stabilized - but they were going to have to send him to Duke Medical Center (about 45 minutes away) for further testing. So after a couple of hours, they found themselves sitting in another waiting room of another pediatric intensive care with another set of worried parents.
It was not as easy for Alex's parents to strike up a conversation this time. They were physically and emotionally exhausted from all they had been through that night. But what else can you do while sitting in the waiting room? After an hour or so of silence, Alex's mother decided to break the ice.
"It's hard sitting here with your child in there, isn't it?" he said.
The father of the other child began to smile, though. "Actually, this is the best day of our life," he said. "You see, our daughter has needed a kidney transplant since she was a little girl. And now, thanks to a teenager in Raleigh whose family donated her organs...."
How often do you get to witness the grace of death and life in the same day?
Moravian in Raleigh
Date: 03 Apr 2000
Time: 18:10:39
to revup- thanks- LPinPA
Date: 03 Apr 2000
Time: 20:24:40
In another discussion group, a comment on this text reflected on "the blood of martyrs being the seed of the Church."
I was wondering if anyone had given thought to going along this line, given that Sunday is the 55th anniversary of Bonhoeffer's martyrdom at the hands of the Nazis.
I've been working with "Sir, we want to see Jesus..." and keep finding myself drawn to Bonhoeffer, seeds, martyrs, and seeing Jesus. Anyone care to help the seminarian sort this out?
Peace Vicar Art in VA
Date: 03 Apr 2000
Time: 20:44:47
Linda in MD, About vs. 31 "Now is the judgement of this world; now the ruler of this world will be driven out." The judgement is against "the ruler of this world" which is the power and presence of evil which the we call satan. Death where is your sting? Satan where is your power? He has none that we do not give him. Jesus is victorious over death and the power of evil. His death and resurrection teach us that death does not have the final word in our lives. He also passes on that same power on to us in the presence and gift of Holy Spirit.
jmj in Wis.
Date: 03 Apr 2000
Time: 20:46:04
Linda in MD, About vs. 31 "Now is the judgement of this world; now the ruler of this world will be driven out." The judgement is against "the ruler of this world" which is the power and presence of evil which the we call satan. Death where is your sting? Satan where is your power? He has none that we do not give him. Jesus is victorious over death and the power of evil. His death and resurrection teach us that death does not have the final word in our lives. He also passes on that same power on to us in the presence and gift of Holy Spirit.
jmj in Wis.
Date: 03 Apr 2000
Time: 20:58:00
God's most glorious work was accomplished on the cross at Calvary and as we are drawn to that powerful act of love we are transformed. The "ruler of this world" has no claim on us. We are transformed by the Spirit of God to do our work in the world. To continue do "even greater works." Jesus drawing all people in to the loving, healing, nurturing Kingdom of God where we "ain't gonna study war no more," where we ain't gonna hate no more, where new people are welcome, where "differant" people are welcome, where we are not satisfied with waiting for them to come in, but we are out there where they are lovin' them in such a way that they are drawn to our Jesus, where we are willing to go without so we can give to others who have less than we do. Oh Lordy, do we have work to do if we are really serious about being Christ-ian, like Christ!!
jmj in WI
Date: 03 Apr 2000
Time: 20:59:21
God's most glorious work was accomplished on the cross at Calvary and as we are drawn to that powerful act of love we are transformed. The "ruler of this world" has no claim on us. We are transformed by the Spirit of God to do our work in the world. To continue do "even greater works." Jesus drawing all people in to the loving, healing, nurturing Kingdom of God where we "ain't gonna study war no more," where we ain't gonna hate no more, where new people are welcome, where "differant" people are welcome, where we are not satisfied with waiting for them to come in, but we are out there where they are lovin' them in such a way that they are drawn to our Jesus, where we are willing to go without so we can give to others who have less than we do. Oh Lordy, do we have work to do if we are really serious about being Christ-ian, like Christ!!
jmj in WI
Date: 03 Apr 2000
Time: 21:23:47
Do we want to truly "see" Jesus for who he really is or are we like those who visit the county fair and want to see the freaks in the sideshow. (I remember the wild man who ate the live chicken!) Somestime it is easier for us to see the sideshow and go off wondering about such strangeness than to see the real Jesus and go away to live like him. GJS in Gulfport
Date: 03 Apr 2000
Time: 21:58:13
Vicar Art -- Your question is EXACTLY why I checked out this site today ... I am trying to do a tribute to Bonhoeffer, but -- am finding it difficult in working with these texts. I'm not offering any help (yet!) but -- would be very interested in knowing about other sites that are engaging in this dialogue ... or, any of the rest of you who are working with this significant day...?? Thanks! meredith in va
Date: 04 Apr 2000
Time: 00:10:31
Vicar Art, meredith, et al - I, too, am struggling to weave these texts together with a tribute to Bonhoeffer. My sermon title came to me after reading Jonathan's entry (above - thanks, Jonathan) - "Straight Down The Middle - A Message to a Growing Church". What popped out at me was the connection between Bonhoeffer's discussion of "cheap grace" and the perspective Jonathan offered from the gospel text - what are we offering to people who fill our pews on Sunday and share in our "life together" if we fail to share the truth, depth and meaning of the cross.... isn't it just "feel-good" theology and cheap grace? The way of the cross calls us to go "straight down the middle", even if Satan is sending Greeks our way to tempt us to sidestep our call to discipleship (I think I need coffee!)- churchmouse in Muskegon, MI
Date: 04 Apr 2000
Time: 01:27:26
The Bonhoffer posts remind me of one of his famous lines, which I paraphrase: When Christ call a persons he calls him to come and die.
Also, any exegetical thoughts on what "serving" with Christ means in this text?
Mike in WV
Date: 04 Apr 2000
Time: 01:39:52
Any thoughts on verse 22? The picture I get is of Philip and Andrew lacking confidence, being somewhat tentative or unsure about taking the Greeks to see Jesus. I wonder what that was about. Janice in Ks.
Date: 04 Apr 2000
Time: 02:04:49
To LP in PA, I love the phrase "movable santuary" in referring to the human heart. Thank you for the poetic image. revavis in KY
Date: 04 Apr 2000
Time: 13:54:26
I am not preaching on Bonhoeffer Sunday but my sermon ideas may help. A good lead in for Bonhoeffer might be the Theology of the Cross "Why did Christ have to suffer?" "Why do we have to suffer?" "Why does the Chirstian way bring suffering?" RevRon
Date: 04 Apr 2000
Time: 13:54:57
I am not preaching on Bonhoeffer Sunday but my sermon ideas may help. A good lead in for Bonhoeffer might be the Theology of the Cross "Why did Christ have to suffer?" "Why do we have to suffer?" "Why does the Chirstian way bring suffering?" RevRon
Date: 04 Apr 2000
Time: 13:57:37
12:24 Very truly, I tell you, unless a grain of wheat falls into the earth and dies, it remains just a single grain; but if it dies, it bears much fruit.
The kenosis of Christ reflects the truth of our own lives - we live only by giving ourselves away in love. Faith is that risking of ourselves, facing the unknown, yet entering it with boldness and expectation that it is there that God will be found. Such was the meaning of the resurrection ... "I have gone ahead of you." When we surrender we find not only a deep peace but also new life.
Only as we let go of ourselves as we are will we know the life that God intends for us; when we fear death we remain isolated from everything except our own despair.
tom in ga
Date: 04 Apr 2000
Time: 14:01:04
Thomas Muntzer: The Bitter and Honey-Sweet Christ
The Sweet Christ
The Doctrine of the sweet Christ asserts that all suffering has already been “accomplished”, in Christ it is already finished. He had done everything for us; we need only “charge it to Christ’s account”; faith is the acceptance of this completed salvation, rady and waiting for us. This faith, “that suffering was put on Christ alone, as though we are not permitted to suffer,” corresponds politically to the two kingdom doctrine, ecclesiastically to infant baptism.
By trusting the sweet Christ “a person wants to be in the image of God so that he no longer wants, does not even completely desire to attain the image of Christ.” Faith remains unexperienced. It is merely received outwardly. To be in the image of God without attaining the image of Christ is a suffering-free Christianity.
The Bitter Christ
The Doctrine of the bitter Christ is experienced in a discipleship of suffering. Suffering, not just believing, is the way to God. No one will be with God, “until he has overcome through his suffering”. First one must endure hell; all other ways, “which bring consolatin before affliction,” bring a faith that is merely received outwardly. The bitter Christ means that we “let God uproot the thorns and thitles” that are in us. “You must endure and know how God himself uproots the weeds, thistles, and thrns out of your fruitful land, that is, out of your heart.”
To attain the image of Christ means to live in revolt against the great Pharoah and to remain with the oppressed, and the disadvantaged. It means to make their lot one’s own. It is easy to be on Pharoah’s side if one just blinks an eye. It is easy to overlook the crosses by which we are surrounded.
If you don’t want to suffer for the sake of God, then you must become the devil’s martyrs. <Dorothee Soelle, Suffering, 1973>
D. Bonhoeffer: Cheap Grace and Costly Grace
Cheap Grace
Cheap grace means grace as doctrine, a principle, a system. It means forgiveness of sins proclaimed as a general truth ... without repentance, baptism without church discipline, Communion without confession, absolution without personal confession. Cheap grace is without discipleship, grace without the cross, grace without Jesus Christ, living and incarnate. Cheap grace is the bitterest foe of discipleship.
Costly Grace
Costly grace is the gospel which must be sought again and again, the gift which must be asked for, the door at which a man must knock. Such grace is costly because it calls us to follow, and itis grace because it calls us to follow Jesus Christ. Costly grace is the Incarnation of God. Grace is costly because it compels a man to submit to the yoke of Christ and follow him; ...< Dietrich Bonhoeffer, The Cost of Discipleship, 1960>
Date: 04 Apr 2000
Time: 14:36:44
Reference Bonhoeffer... While stationed in Germany, I had the privilege of leading several soldier professional development trips to Flossenberg Prison Camp where Bonhoeffer was executed weeks before the camp was liberated. A monument stands next to the only remaining, restored prison house in the park complex, a hundred yards or so from the crematorium. His name along with others arrested for conspiracy against Hitler are etched in stone with the words (in German) of 2 Timothy 1:7, "FOR GOD DID NOT GIVE US A SPIRIT OF TIMIDITY, BUT A SPIRIT OF POWER, OF LOVE, AND OF SELF-DISCIPLINE." Next to the crematorium is a mound about 8 feet tall of ashes (now covered with grass) of the remains of the victims of the brutality of the Nazis. Each of the trips I led would wind up at the chapel erected out of stones from the old guard towers where we would discuss leadership, courage, integrity, and faithfulness. "Whoever serves me, the Father will honor!" V. 26 Army Chaplain E. Ft. Belvoir
Date: 04 Apr 2000
Time: 14:37:51
Reference Bonhoeffer... While stationed in Germany, I had the privilege of leading several soldier professional development trips to Flossenberg Prison Camp where Bonhoeffer was executed weeks before the camp was liberated. A monument stands next to the only remaining, restored prison house in the park complex, a hundred yards or so from the crematorium. His name along with others arrested for conspiracy against Hitler are etched in stone with the words (in German) of 2 Timothy 1:7, "FOR GOD DID NOT GIVE US A SPIRIT OF TIMIDITY, BUT A SPIRIT OF POWER, OF LOVE, AND OF SELF-DISCIPLINE." Next to the crematorium is a mound about 8 feet tall of ashes (now covered with grass) of the remains of the victims of the brutality of the Nazis. Each of the trips I led would wind up at the chapel erected out of stones from the old guard towers where we would discuss leadership, courage, integrity, and faithfulness. "Whoever serves me, the Father will honor!" V. 26 Army Chaplain E. Ft. Belvoir
Date: 04 Apr 2000
Time: 16:15:57
Thanks for the Bonhoeffer excerpts. Resources on the Web which have added to my thinking about John's "a grain of wheat falling... and following...where I am there will my servant be also...losing life...now is my soul troubled..." are: 1) from Westminter Abbey's new statues project honoring 20th c.martyrs http://westminster-abbey.org/Martyrs/dietrich_bonhoeffer.htm
and 2) the Dietrich Bonhoeffer Home Page http://www.cyberword.com/bonhoef/
and 3)another perspective in an archival discussion from the Jerusalem Post Daily Internet Edition from 29Ap98 http://www.jpost.com/com/Archive/29.Apr.1998/Features/Article-6.html
socalb
Date: 04 Apr 2000
Time: 16:21:48
Responding to the comments about Bonhoeffer, in addition to the publications of his writings of sermons and essays such as "No Rusty Swords" and his books such as "Cost of Discipleship", "Life Together" and the gathering of various writings in "A Testmaent to Freedom" edited by Geffrey Kelly and Burton Nelson, there is a 1996 publication entitled "Dietrich Bonhoeffer- Meditations on the Cross" (Westinster John Knox Press) which pulls together writings on the cross from various books, sermons, essays written by Bonhoeffer. The essays and excerpts in that book seem to relate well to the issues in this text and might be a good resource for those highlighting the Bonhoeffer contributions. John from CFUMC in Ga.
Date: 04 Apr 2000
Time: 17:08:09
ANybody know these?
I am looking for two illustrations which I have heard in the past, but they are a little bit fuzzy in my recollection.
The first has to do with some famous trapese artist who strung up a tightrope across Niagra Falls. He went back and forth and gathered a huge crowd that was watching him spellbound. Then he got a wheelbarrow up there and asked the crowd, how many of them believed that he could cross the wire with the wheelbarrow. Most everybody raised their hands. Then he said, since you believe I can do this, who would like to get into the wheelbarrow? Nobody volunteered.
Anybody know who the tightrope artist was and when this happened? I believe it is a true story.
The other illustration has to do with a mountain climber who got into some kind of a jam and was at the end of a cliff with hundreds of feet below him and certain death if he jumped - for some reason he couldn't turn back. He felt God's Spirit nudging him to jump and eventually he screwed up his courage and jumped, only to fall just a few feet to a hidden switchback that was below the cliff.
I love these two illustrations of "taking the step of faith" but I would like more detail if anybody knows it.
Thanks tons!
DEK in MN
Date: 04 Apr 2000
Time: 19:04:20
Vicar Art in Va and other Bonhoeffer/martyr folks: This morning I heard a sermon on this text. The preacher mentioned Romero and Martin Luther King Junior, both were martyrs for the faith. (Romero was assassinated on March 24, 1980 in a hospital chapel in El Salvador.) The theme of the sermon was "There's a troubling in my soul." I don't know if this helps, but the martyrdom topic/illustation seemed to work well. DV at GETS
Date: 04 Apr 2000
Time: 19:33:58
Concerning Bonhoeffer, these verses from the lectionary stand out to me:12:23 Jesus answered them, "The hour has come for the Son of Man to be glorified. 12:24 Very truly, I tell you, unless a grain of wheat falls into the earth and dies, it remains just a single grain; but if it dies, it bears much fruit. 12:25 Those who love their life lose it, and those who hate their life in this world will keep it for eternal life. 12:26 Whoever serves me must follow me, and where I am, there will my servant be also. Whoever serves me, the Father will honor. Speaks about Christ, speaks about Bonhoeffer and his oppostion to cheap grace AUGGIE
Date: 04 Apr 2000
Time: 20:35:25
To DEK in MN - The story of the tightrope and the wheelbarrow is told in Hot Illustrations for Youth Talks and is thus: The story is told of a great circus performer by the name of Blondin who stretched a long steel cable across Niagara Falls. During high winds and without a safety net, he walked, ran, and even danced across the tightrope to the amazement and delight of the large crowd of people who watched. Once he took a wheelbarrow full of bricks and amazed the crowd by pushing it effortlessly across the cable, from one side of the falls to the other. Blondin then turned to the crowd and asked, "Now, how many of you believe that I could push a man across the wire in the wheelbarrow?"
The vote was unanimous. Everyone cheered and held their hands high. They all believed he could do it! "Then", asked Blondin, "would one of you please volunteer to be that man?" As quickly as the hands went up, they went back down. Not a single person would volunteer to ride in the wheelbarrow and to trust his life to Blondin.
Hope this helps. . . LA in IA
Date: 05 Apr 2000
Time: 02:34:25
To DEK in MN... the "version" of the tightrope story that I am familiar with is not as factual as the posting from LA in IA, but it offers a different twist depending on how you want to use it. Here goes...
Most successful people are people who take risks - calculated risks - but nevertheless, risks.
Consider the case of the rising young executive who suddenly found himself unemployed when his company went through a downsizing.
When he asked "Why me?" the vice president, who was the young man's superior, explained that he was too conservative in the way he did his job. “Things have gotten more competitive," the vice president explained. "Our people have to look at things from different angles and they have to take risks. And when they take risks, they have to believe they'll succeed. That's where you come up short."
For six months the young man tried to get a job and failed. Then one day he met a retired circus tightrope walker. The two had something in common... time on their hands. Before long, the unemployed executive became an accomplished tightrope walker.
He became so good that he and his circus mentor were asked to participate in a televised charity event at Niagara Falls, and the young man invited his former boss to attend. “I'll show him who can take risks," he said.
All went well at the event. The young man successfully crossed the falls on the tightrope, followed by his circus mentor, who also pushed a wheelbarrow across. The vice president congratulated the young man and then dared him to cross over the falls again, this time pushing the wheelbarrow. "You can do it if you believe you can," said the vice president.
"Do you believe I can?" the young man asked his former boss.
"Yes, I do," the vice president replied.
"Okay," said the young man, "get in the wheelbarrow."
Jo in MO
Date: 05 Apr 2000
Time: 02:48:37
Here is another version of the tightrope walker. There was a tightrope walker, who did incredible aerial feats. All over Paris, he would do tightrope acts at tremendously scary heights. Then he had succeeding acts; he would do it blindfolded, pushing a wheelbarrow. An American promoter read about this in the papers and wrote a letter to the tightrope walker, saying, "Tightrope, I don't believe you can do it, but I'm willing to make you an offer. For a very substantial sum of money, besides all your transportation fees, I would like to challenge you to do your act over Niagara Falls" Now, Tighrope wrote back, "Sir, I've never been to America and seen the Falls, I'd love to come." Well, after a lot of promotion and setting the whole thing up, many people came to see the event. Tightrope was to start on the Canadian side and come to the American side. Drums rolled, and he came across the rope which was suspended over the most treacherous part of the falls and blindfolded!! And he made it across quite easily. The crowd went wild. He then came to the promoter and said, "Well, Mr. Promoter, now do you believe I can do it?" "Well of course I do. I mean, I just saw you do it." "No," said Tightrope, "do you really believe I can do it?" "Well of course I do, you just did it." "No, no, no," said Tightrope, "do you believe I can do it?" "Yes," said Mr. Promoter, "I believe you can do it." "Good," said Tightrope, "then get in the wheelbarrow. "
Date: 05 Apr 2000
Time: 03:49:44
Okay--take a shot at this. "Now is my soul troubled. And what should I say--'Father, save me from this hour'? No, it is for this reason that I have come to this hour." *This* hour, *this* reason--**what** reason is "this reason"? It may be that Jesus referred to the "obvious" cross in its future, especially given the "dying seed" in v. 24, the life-losing in v.25, and the "when I am lifted up" in v.32. But what if "this reason" is--that his soul is troubled. What I'm suggesting is that Jesus (JN1:14!!) walked the human walk to "this hour" when (precisely when--and for the precise reason that--) his soul was *troubled* NOW he knows us! Now he really knows the ambiguity-ridden folk His cross is all about. Not until "this hour" (when, btw, not only Greeks but "the world has gone after him" {the Pharisees in v.19}), did Jesus discover the deep pain of the troubled soul who can see great success there for the plucking at the very moment he discovers that success to be the enemy his life has sworn to defeat. That His soul might become [as] troubled [as mine is], I am pondering, may be precisely "this reason" that Jesus has come to "this hour." GG in NC
Date: 05 Apr 2000
Time: 10:49:14
My soul is troubled..... Everyone of us must get beyond the “Now my soul is troubled” to willingly turn ourselves totally over to God. Jesus faced his agony as we must face ours. We must die before me die. This is totally against our human self-centered nature. Jesus loved God...... the true test came when He trusted God. We say we love God but the bottom line is do we trust God? When Jesus asked Peter, “Do you love me? and after Peter answered, Jesus said, “Feed my sheep.” It came after the cross. Peter’s example to trust stood before him. Now it was Peters’ turn for, “Now my soul is troubled.” Still trying to pull my thoughts together. LPinPA
Date: 05 Apr 2000
Time: 12:52:26
OK DEK in MN - now for the definitive tightrope-walker-over-Niagara story!!!
In 1859 Charles Blondin, the French Acrobat, walked across a tightrope suspended across Niagara Falls.
One day, thousands watched him as he pushed a bag of cement in a wheelbarrow along the wire, fifty metres above the raging waters. There was a great cheer when he reached the other side.
Then Blondin challenged a nearby reporter: “Do you believe I can do anything on a tightrope?”
“Oh yes, Mr Blondin,” said the reporter: “After what I’ve seen today, I believe it. You can do anything.” However, the reporter melted into the crowd when he was invited to put his trust to the test and get into the wheelbarrow.
But, there was a person who did trust Blondin with his life. He got into the wheelbarrow and was pushed across the wire. As Blondin made his way high above the falls, people quickly placed bets on the outcome. It looked like any other easy conquest. But, when they were half way across the 500 metre journey of trust, a man with a heavy bet against Blondin’s success, crept across and cut one of the guy ropes.
Suddenly, the tightrope pitched crazily back and forth. Blondin fought for his balance, only seconds away from death. For, when the rim of the wheelbarrow came off the wire, they could both be pitched into the churning water. Blondin spoke, cutting through the terror of his passenger. “Stand up!” he ordered. “Stand up and grab my shoulders.”
The man sat there paralysed.
“Let go and stand up! Let go of the wheelbarrow! Do it or die!”
Somehow the man managed to stand up and step out of the swaying wheelbarrow.
“Your arms ... put them around my neck! Now, your legs ... round my waist!” said Blondin.
Again the man obeyed, clinging to Blondin. The wheelbarrow fell, disappearing into the frothy turmoil far below. The aerialist stood there, using all his years of experience and every trained muscle to stay on the wire until the pitching subsided a little. Then, inch by inch, he made his way across, carrying the man like a child. Finally, he deposited him safely on the other side.
c/- Desperate Preacher, South Australia.
Date: 05 Apr 2000
Time: 16:13:49
Getting back to Jonathan's discussion of the Greeks, I wonder, what were those Greeks doing in Jerusalem during the passover? It reminds me of something that happened in my church last year. About 5 or 10 minutes into the service, a group of at least 30 or 40 people walked into the back of the sanctuary, and took seats along the side pews. They were kind of looking around. They sat through the scripture readings and the children's sermon and began the next hymn. And then suddenly they all got up and walked out. It took me a minute to realize what was happening. (It is still a guess...) They were with a tour group that had gotten the wrong address. They thought they were coming to Harlem to see "black people singing". Technically they were in Harlem, and our ushers did happen to be black that day (our church is well integrated). But when they realized that it wasn't going to be the kind of show they expected, they got up and left. (Another group showed up the next week, but the ushers set them straight before they disrupted the service.) Were the Greeks there to worship, or were they just checking out the scene? Debra in NYC
Date: 05 Apr 2000
Time: 16:38:35
Thanks you guys! I've been having a 'Bonhoeffer feast' with all of the suggestions and what they have stirred for me in my own research and study. At this point, I am leaning towards rethinking v. 27 as "Save me FOR this hour..." ...i.e. the prayer of costly discipleship ... It was also the challenge for Esther - "perhaps you have been appointed for such a time as this" ...the thought works well with a tribute to Bonhoeffer as well as the other lectionary lessons. Thoughts? meredith in va
Date: 05 Apr 2000
Time: 16:53:02
What about Jesus's teaching that, 'Whoever serves me must follow me; and where I am, my servant also will be.."? How often do we try to serve Jesus on our own instead of following the path of service that he has chosen for us? Do we avoid God's will because we somehow know that sonner or later we will end up at the Cross?
Date: 05 Apr 2000
Time: 17:41:13
Thanks to all those who reminded us of the Bonhoeffer connection. These passages dovetail wonderfully with his own commitment to follow Jesus "Whowever serves me must follow me, and where I am there will my servant be also." Bonhoeffer was also willing to risk his life. Along the lines of suffering, I would offer this quote from Ann Morrow Lindberg. "I do not believe suffering teaches. If suffering alone taught, all the world would be wise, since everyone suffers. To sufering must be added mourning, understanding, patience, love, openness, and the willingness to remain vulnerable." I believe that it is this willingness to remain vulnerable that marks Christ's suffering for us and our own call to risk suffering for the the gospel. That is, suffering in and of itself is not redemptive. It is how we suffer and for what and for whom that makes it redemptive. Just some thoughts. LP in CO
Date: 05 Apr 2000
Time: 22:05:08
Denise Giardina in her wonderful novel on the life of Bonhoeffer, shows a real man struggling with his concern for safety, his desire for peace, his love for country, and his sense of what it means to be a disciple. While he was pastoring in London during the early years of Hitler, he lived with a lot of depression. He thought seriously of going to India and studying with Ghandi, even received an invitation to do so. But at the same time Niemoller invited him to come back to Germany and head a new seminary for the resistance church. Nothing wrong with Ghandi, but for Bonhoeffer, it was the Greek's calling, a way out of suffering. His hour came, and he took passage to Germany. jpwes
Date: 05 Apr 2000
Time: 22:21:33
In response to Janice in Ks,
I'm planning to focus on the reaction of the disciples (or the lack thereof). Some new people come and ask to see Jesus, and what do they do? Do they bring these newcomers in joyfully, thrilled ast the opportunity to help their Lord spread the good news? No. They hesitate, uncertain, they want to check everything out first to make sure it's okay.
Our bishop, a few years ago, addressed the annual meeting of church reps in the Diocese and challenged us. He said that there are hundreds and thousands of people out there who want to see God. But when they look at teh churches, somehow they see only hypocrites or bureaucracy or whatever. And should they venture in, we insist on using words like "eschatology" and "apocalypse" and "salvation," concepts which are a foreign language to most people in our culture. And that's assuming anyone talks to them at all; all too often, we get so focussed on catching up with friends at church that newcomers get left out.
That seems to have been what happened to the Greeks inthe story. They're never mentioned again. The disciple get all caught up in what Jesus was saying to them, that they never went back to invite the newcomers in.
So I'm planning to talk about our calling to help others around us to see Jesus today, both in our individual lives as Christians and as a Church, as the Body of Christ in the world here and now.
Heather in Newmarket
Date: 05 Apr 2000
Time: 23:50:10
Thanks for all the input on Bonhoeffer. He has had a powerful impact especially via. The Cost Of Discipleship.
Evangelist David Watson said that Christ died for all but not every Christian is called to be a disciple. The implication is that not every Christian is required to pay the high cost of discipleship but those who are willing are invited into closer communion with Christ. Its not that Christ rejects anyone who is unwilling to take up their cross or that anyone should be guilted into doing so. Rather those who are willing to take up their cross to follow Jesus shall be greatly rewarded but there is indeed great suffering and sacrifice for those who are willing to take up their cross and follow.
What do you think? Are there higher standards of discipleship?
Date: 06 Apr 2000
Time: 01:21:14
Thanks, Heather, for that great reminder. I'm going to talk about "the Greeks" ... and remind the congregation that to those hearing the Gospel, "Greek" didn't mean folks from Athens, but anyone foreign, "secular", different ... not-a-Jew. How good a job, indeed, are we doing at answering the questions of those who come to our churches saying, "Please, we want to see Jesus!" Do we show them instead our theology or our liturgy or our ecclesiology ... and leave them wondering what the fuss is all about.
Who are the "Greeks" God is sending to us and can we do a better job than Philip did in bringing them to Jesus?
In addressing the Human Rights Campaign last week Judy Shepard quoted Ghandi: "We must be the change we wish to see in the world." For Christians, JESUS was the incarnation of that change ... a life lived in absolute connection and obedience to God. When we are given the grace to live that way ... even for a moment ... then we follow Jesus in that way of the cross that looms in these waning days of Lent.
Blessings, Susan in SanPedro
Date: 06 Apr 2000
Time: 11:54:06
Is it to late to add this contribuion? Thanks to all who pointed me in the direction of Bonhoeffer and also for that wonderful image of our hearts as moveable sanctuaries. I found this quote from Bonhoeffer on Suffering.'It is infinitely easier to suffer in obedience to a human command than to accept suffering as free, responsible men. It is infinitely easier to suffer with others than to suffer alone. It is infinitely easier to suffer as public heroes than to suffer apart and in ignominy. It is infinitely easier to suffer physical death than to suffer spiritual suffering. Christ suffered as a free man alone, apart and in ignominy, in body and in spirit, and since that day many Christians have suffered with him." Its hard to begin to understand the struggle that Jesus was facing within himself and even harder for us to surrender to God's will when we know that suffering is involved. This is my first contribution so I hope it's of use RM in Wales
Date: 06 Apr 2000
Time: 12:28:45
I found a powerful illustration that I plan on using with this text. It relates to anxiety of the future. Jesus KNOWS that in the very near future He will be crucified and His "soul is troubled". Consider the state prison inmate in a prison in Concord, NH (Washington Post - Dec 99) who "quaking at the prospect of seeing in 2000 sewed his eyes and lips shut wtih dental floss, officials said. Guards found the inmate, who was serving time for cocaine possession, covered in baby powder and clutching a Bible Friday night. The inmate told corrections officers he was in 'fear of the new year,' said Mark Wefers, a prison official." Though His soul was troubled, Christ did not curl up in a ball and cower in fear, paralyzed at the prospect of the cross. He gives us the courage to face our anxieties knowing that death and hell are conquered. - Army Chaplain E, Ft Belvoir
Date: 06 Apr 2000
Time: 15:45:19
The mystery of the human person is his/her ability to give him/herself away, to love. This is at the heart of our Lord's parable of the gain of wheat. Jesus glorification is his gift to us, for we participate in his glory, this unconditional self-giving love which finds its fulfillment on the Cross and in the power of the resurrection.
tom in ga
Date: 06 Apr 2000
Time: 15:46:34
The mystery of the human person is his/her ability to give him/herself away, to love. This is at the heart of our Lord's parable of the gain of wheat. Jesus glorification is his gift to us, for we participate in his glory, this unconditional self-giving love which finds its fulfillment on the Cross and in the power of the resurrection.
tom in ga
Date: 06 Apr 2000
Time: 20:53:35
"Now is my soul troubled." Is this the same Jesus who walked on the stormy sea?--Who faced demons and cast them out--who offered grace to a despised prostitute--the Jesus who was (nearly) always composed and calm?
The text is somewhat disjointed. We don't know if all his comments were to the Greeks or to the disciples or to others.
I'm thinking it's possible there is a break between verses 26 & 27, and that verse 27 is Jesus expressing his deep pain and sorrow to his disciples for his coming separation from them. It seems obvious he wasn't speaking to the crowd, for the crowd didn't understand the "voice from heaven." And why did Jesus say, "the voice is for your benefit, not mine," when the crowd wasn't able to understand the voice?
Clarence in Iowa
Date: 06 Apr 2000
Time: 21:14:12
The BIBLE KNOWLEDGE COMMENTARY on my computer seems to agree with me...
Jesus instructed His disciples on the cost of commitment to the Father’s will by disclosing His emotions. He was in turmoil (, “stirred, agitated”; cf. 11:33; 14:1) because of the prospect of being made sin (2 Cor. 5:21) in His death. In view of His turmoil, should He shrink back and ask for deliverance from this hour? Certainly not, for His Incarnation was for the very purpose of bringing Him to this hour (cf. John 12:23; 13:1; 17:1). Jesus willingly expressed His submission to the will of the Father in the words, Father, glorify Your name! So also believers in difficulty should stand and embrace His will—desiring that His name be glorified—in spite of conflicting emotions.
Clarence in Iowa
Date: 06 Apr 2000
Time: 21:27:06
I'm just thinking in these last few days of Jesus' life, how there must have been a forboding, an aching deep in his heart, a sorrow and pain of his coming death. He loved these people as no one else could. And he would soon be taken away. How it must have hurt him emotionally to struggle humanly with these thoughts.
We had a woman in our church who had been for the past couple of weeks living with fear that her cancer had returned. She had two breast surgeries 5 & 7 years ago, and now had discovered another lump in her chest. It was surgically removed, and the doctors reported it was cancerous. They did CAT scan to see if it had spread. It had NOT! But in the time from the recent surgery until she heard the good news, she lived in the grip of the fear that her life would soon be over. What is it like to live in that fear? You're all alone. No one can go with you that mile of the way. That's where Jesus was--alone with the knowledge of his coming death, alone in his concept of being a sacrifice for the world--he had tried to communicate it to his disciples, but they were pretty oblivious. There must have been a deep sadness in Jesus' heart. But there was the powerful pull of destiny in his heart. THIS was why he had come into the world. He had no choice but to follow that call all the way to the cross.
Clarence in Iowa
Date: 06 Apr 2000
Time: 22:26:06
Just like the Jeremiah text, I know the hope that this week's Gospel gives me. I live in a farming community. For some of these people, it is an act of faith to plow and plant every year. The stock market may see rising prices but the stock that I see going to market has not. These are people who know what thousands of pounds of hybrid seed costs and the possibility that it brings in feeding the world. I tell them that they participate in creation in their fields. Those seeds need to be nurtured and watered and see light of the sun. That which looks dead is really the begining of new life. Isn't that what following Christ does for us? Each little death of sin becomes an occasion for renewed life. Seeds of knowledge grow with some nuturing agape of a faithfilled community and the light of the Son. I love all the images that everyone has been sharing. Grace is not cheap, but the price was already paid. PS in Iowa
Date: 06 Apr 2000
Time: 23:13:24
COMPLETE SERMON "fumbling in the dark"
John Nadasi, lutherfetch@yahoo.com
John 12:20-36 Eads and Haswell UMC April 9, 2000
In every age men and women have stood at the foot of the cross attempting to understand the meaning of what happened there, and why anyone would ever volunteer for such a horrible death.
One leading New Testament scholar recently wrote an article saying that there are at least fourteen different theological perspectives of the cross presented in scripture.
It would seem that the cross is so vast in its meaning And extraordinary in its calling, that one perspective cannot simply capture its meaning.
However, there is at least one consistency. Whoever you are, and whatever your beliefs, the cross is impossible to ignore.
In this weeks lectionary text, We find Jesus explaining to the disciples the cross that awaits him And why he must go.
He, afterall, had his own way of doing things. Jesus put the truth very strongly at times, And in this week’s readings, he stated that those who love their lives will lose them, but those who hate their lives in this world will save them, and keep them unto eternal life.
He gets your attention, doesn’t he? This certainly is a belief that we do not see very often in our modern world. How many people do you know that live this out? I would imagine this perspective was as different in Jesus’ time As it would be in our own.
Why is it that Jesus’ perspective is so different than ours? We all see the world so differently. When walking in the forest the lumberjack sees trees that are ripe for harvesting, the carpenter sees the different kinds of wood for different kinds of furniture and buildings,
the hunter sees the places in which animals might hide when the season is open, and the farmer sees fertile land that could benefit from clearing.
We all have our own unique perspective in which we see the world. And Jesus, Jesus had a unique perspective on the world that none of us Could ever hope to have. Jesus was the Son of God.
And in his perspective, Jesus saw and lived out the Kingdom of God in everything he said and did. And, he followed this vision to the cross that awaited him. He not only followed it out of a sense of destiny, But he followed it out of love and a conviction that He was doing God’s will.
Hmm. How many of us would follow him there? Would you? How many of us would follow Jesus all the way to the cross?
Jesus came among us to rescue and reclaim lost souls, to set us free from the power of sin and death by returning us to God's love, God's law, God's power.
And Jesus did this, at great cost to himself. As he said to a man who thought to follow him "Foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests, but the Son of Man has no place to lay his head".
Jesus renounced everything for the sake of bringing life to those around him: his family - his home, - and finally, his very life he lay down so that others might live, so that others might know the face of God.
Who here would follow him? Who would be willing to leave everything that they have and give Their own life that others would know God?
How is it that Jesus retreated from the comfort Of power, wealth, and prestige to instead become a servant?
I was reading an article recently on the emptiness of wealth. Did this come from a religious magazine, pastor’s sermon, or homiletics book? No. Actually, it is an investor’s report written by a stockbroker, Dr. Paul Farrell, from CBS MarketWatch to be exact.
“In a recent column we asked: "Why Are Investors So Cranky?" Emails poured in.
The bottom line was unanimous. America's so-called new wealth equation is not working. The wealth equation claims that economic prosperity, an increase in the number of American millionaires, from 8 million in 2000 to 50 million in 2020, will actually increase our level of happiness and ethical behavior.
But reality is that the bull market is not making investors happier Getting rich makes Americans more fearful and anxious. Prosperity is not increasing our ethical behavior In short, more wealth is just making us crankier
He continues with… In fact, it turns out that, paradoxically, there may actually be an inverse relationship between money and happiness.
The wealthier, the richer, the more money you got, the crankier you get.
He goes on to make the following observations…
"Everywhere, by all means imaginable, people are striving to improve their lives. Yet strangely, my impression is that those living in materially developed countries, for all their industry, are in some ways less satisfied, are less happy, and to some extent suffer more than those in the least developed countries.
"Indeed, if we compare the rich with the poor, it often seems that those with nothing are, in fact, the least anxious, although they are plagued with physical pains and suffering. "The rich "are so caught up in the idea of acquiring still more that they make no room for anything else in their lives [so] they actually lose the dream of happiness."
Brilliant! Folks, this is an extraordinarily well written, articulate, and thought out article By a man who has most likely never missed a meal in his life.
But, it does offer to us something this morning. It does offer us a confirmation to what Jesus taught, And it offers us a new perspective on what is important and what is not.
No, I personally do not believe there is anything good about poverty, Nor do I believe it is right to glorify not being able to meet your family’s needs.
However, there is a message in this article that proves to me, Beyond any doubt, that the wealth, power, and prestige we want will never Bring us the happiness that we desire in life.
Oh, it might solve some of your problems, But then, it is guaranteed to create new sufferings of its own.
Suffering is inevitable. It is the price of being human.
Carl Jung, a God fearing psychologist, offered another insight to this human tendency.
As the world around us gets more prosperous, reducing real suffering, paradoxically, we naturally seek ways to replace real suffering with psychological suffering.
But in this evolutionary process, we become more acutely aware and conscious of our suffering, and the suffering of others.
In English, we strive to hold onto what makes us human both suffering and happiness.
And, as we do so, we become more aware of both as our world becomes more prosperous. In other words, The more excess we have, the softer we become. The softer we become, the more sensitive we become to pain.
Talk about putting your money where your faith is. How does one walk away from money and power? It is so alluring and promising of a better life.
It makes me question the commercial that the Wall Street Journal is running on television right now.
In it, there are two brothers who are separated at birth. One brother goes to a family that subscribes to the Wall Street Journal, The other brother goes to a family that subscribes to fishing magazines.
As the commercial goes on, The brother that was in the family with fishing magazines is doomed to a Blue collar and mediocre life.
And the brother that was in the family that subscribed to the journal Became filthy, stinking rich.
Well, that’s all well and good, But I found myself asking, Which of these two men have a more fulfilling existence?
The one who sits at a computer screen day after day Stressing over predicting the unpredictable stock market,
Or is it the brother who rises in the morning to go to the lake, Watch the sun come up, See the ducks come off the water And listen to the geese as they rise for their early morning flight? And feel the gentle breeze as the day begins to warm?
Who is more content with their life? The man driving the used pickup truck to go fishing before work, Or the brother sweating the next inevitable crash, Too addicted to the market to give it up?
These fantasies of prosperity and wealth do present some valid questions for us.
So, what does the Gospel reading this morning offer to us? What can we take from it this morning to enrich our lives And make them more meaningful and fulfilled?
Perhaps, more than anything, A new perspective.
Like the lumberjack, carpenter, hunter, and farmer, We have a limited perspective on the forest in which we live.
How about this morning, We look at the world through Christ’s eyes, And his journey to the cross.
Jesus said Unless a kernel of wheat falls to the ground and dies, it remains but a single seed.
But if it dies, it produces many seeds. The man who loves his life in this world will lose it, but the man who hates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life.
This is part of the law of God - given in the new covenant; the law that God has written upon our hearts, which is fruitful in us and can bring meaning to our lives if we allow ourselves to hear it and to heed it.
No, it is not the way the world thinks. It certainly is not the message of prosperity or instant success we See advertised day after day on television.
However, it is the way that God has wired each and every one of us. It is the “law” of God “written upon our hearts.” Folks, its just the way we are wired.
And, Jesus knew this inner law of God, this law that states that the more we seek for ourselves, the more attached we become to the life we have, the more we seek to avoid pain and suffering, the more we ignore the needs of others and seek instead to meet our own, the more wretched we become and the closer to death we are. The tighter you try and hang on to your life and control Every possibility within it, The more you will spin out of control.
And, I think that most of us would agree with that. We at least get it at some conscious level.
If I asked today how many people here believe what I am saying is true I bet most of us would raise our hands.
However, living it out is another story. We recognize what is good for us and what is not, But we as individuals and as a nation have trouble living out our beliefs.
We know what is right, But we are sometimes slow to act upon it, Because we begin to question ourselves and how deep our convictions Really lie when they bring about our own discomfort or pain.
And then, we feel guilty, or perhaps even convicted by the Holy Spirit that our life is not in accord with God’s will for us.
So what are we to do? Seek pain for ourselves?
Well, it has been tried before, It even has a name, its called asceticism, But I do not think that is the answer either.
Let’s turn back to the text. there is something else here that brings me great comfort when I think about this. When I think about the many ways I fumble in the darkness and struggle through my everyday life, and I wonder why my life does not always Represent the ideals that I hold for myself,
I find comfort that Jesus struggled with this too. Even Jesus second guessed himself from time to time.
What am I talking about? Let’s look at verse 27. “Now my soul is troubled. What should I say, Father save me from this hour? No, it is for this reason that I have come to this hour.”
Yet, that is what he asks for in the Lukan account. Chapter 22, verse 42, “Father if you are willing, take this cup away from me.”
Jesus, was no fool. Jesus did not want the pain of the cross he did not want death, he prayed to God that the cup would pass him by.
So, what makes him different? If Jesus questioned himself also, how is he to lead us? Well, he stayed focussed on the part that really mattered, And above all else, he trusted. He trusted that God’s purpose for him, As dismal as it seemed at the moment, Was truly for the best.
If you continue with verse 42, Jesus prays, “yet not my will be done, but yours.”
People of God, we are going to struggle for purpose, We are going to doubt ourselves, We are going to continue to fumbling in the darkness, But in this stumbling and fumbling, If we seek God and are willing to journey to the cross, We can find fulfillment in our lives.
In many ways we are like the people in the story. We have come here wishing to see Jesus. We have heard about Jesus and want to be his servants As we have come to learn that this is in our best interest.
So we have come to learn about him so we can serve him and tell others about him. But as his servants we are supposed to go where he goes.
Although it is easy to follow Jesus when he is raising people from the dead, it is a lot harder to follow him when he is headed for the cross. There is nothing happy here. This is not a good time. Yet, it was where God directed him to go, And where his life’s purpose was fulfilled.
People of God, if we wish to follow Jesus there are crosses in our future as well If we seek to be disciples of Jesus then there will be some dark times ahead just as there were dark times for Jesus’ first disciples.
If we want the eternal life that comes only through Jesus we can not cling to this life as if it is all that exists. That is as hard or even harder to accept now as it was back then.
But Jesus offers us hope in times of darkness. The light is with us now. Christ is here.
If we will trust in the light we will become sons and daughters of the light. Then, when the darkness comes, we will not be left fumbling in the dark.
Folks, If this sounds all too abstract and ethereal to make any sense to you, Then listen to these words…
I am sure you have all heard the expression, “Let go, let God.”
In fact, you have probably heard it enough that is somewhat of a cliché. But, people of God, take this seriously this morning. You can find fulfillment if you are truly willing to let go and trust.
If you desire meaning and purpose for your life, Seek God’s face first. Be prepared to find that God’s desire for your life Will be different and in the end, far better than your own.
Folks, this is just the way we are wired. It is the way that God has designed and engineered us to run. God has “written his law upon our hearts.” Serving God and others is the only way to truly find fulfillment and purpose.
Thomas Merton wrote the following prayer. I have printed it for you in the bulletin.
I will read it for you, And then, we will read it together. Think about these words, Let them sink in.
See that they are the words that God has written upon your heart.
My Lord God, I have no idea where I am going. I do not see the road ahead of me. I cannot know for certain where it will end. Nor do I really know myself, and the fact that I think I am following Your will does not mean that I am actually doing so.
But I believe that the desire to please You does in fact please You. And I hope I have that desire for all that I am doing. I hope that I will never do anything apart from that desire. And I know that if I do this You will lead me by the right road, though I may know nothing about it.
Therefore I will trust You always though I may seem to be lost and in the shadow of death. I will not fear, for You are ever with me, and You will never leave me to face my perils alone. -Amen
Date: 06 Apr 2000
Time: 23:35:49
To LA in IA, Jo in MO, DP in Australia and others,
THANK YOU for your responses to my request regarding the tightrope walker! I am going to use it.
DEK in MN
Date: 07 Apr 2000
Time: 00:08:41
Seems that Marcus borg provides us with good material when he speaks of the Jesus we never knew, the Jesus we never really met becuase he was distorted. Perhaps we speak as well about the yes through which Jesus sees us... Tony DeMello helps us in the book Sadhana... helps us see the eyes of acceptance and embracing with which jesus sees us.
anyone know the song...
open our eyes lord open our eyes lord, we want to see jesus, to reach out and touch him, and say that we love him. open our eyes lord, and help us to listen, open our eyes lord, we want to see jesus.
its beautiful... it is in anumber of hymnals..
pastordon, elmira,ny
Date: 07 Apr 2000
Time: 00:10:42
make a correction here...
Seems that Marcus Borg provides us with good material when he speaks of the Jesus we never knew, the Jesus we never really met becuase he was distorted. Perhaps we speak as well about the EYES through which Jesus sees us...
pastordon, elmira,ny
Date: 07 Apr 2000
Time: 02:58:42
i usually try to have my sermon done by now, and here i am just starting. the greeks coming to Jesus to me opens up the sense that for Jesus to become universal, he must not be limited by time and space. i too have wondered if "see" relates to the "real" spiritual seeing of John - believing - or relates a spiritual blindness. what else i keep seeing in this is flip wilson doing his "the devil made me do it" routine , and i want to add: "not!" because Christ has overcome the devil and then so have we. the other image that comes to me is also silly - of a skit we did as kids, saying "is it time?" on and on down the line to which the response is always no, and then finally "yes" and everyone changes the leg they have cross. sorry to be so trivial during the seriousness of Lent, but it won't go away. wish i knew more about wheat dying - and how to type.
thanks and blessings, rachel
Date: 07 Apr 2000
Time: 19:20:23
"Sir, we wish to see Jesus."
This seem to be the heart of it! What does it mean to "see Jesus" - can you see him from a distance, from an objective position? Is it possible to "see Jesus" without being involved, without patterning your life on His? Can you "see Jesus" if you are a tither, a churchgoer, a moralist? What does it take to "see Jesus?" I remember so years ago being asked to come to a banker's office, he was new in town, for me to tell him something about the Christian faith. He wanted some illustrations, some "facts" but it was clear, as I told him, only until he gets his feet wet, only until he jumps in and risks all will he KNOW! Jesus did not answer the Greeks, but turns to his followers and reminds them "unless a grain of wheat." .... only then, only when we surrender, let go, release, and fall into a new relationship, do we know who Jesus is "as the one who became the source of eternal salvation for all who obey him, having been designated by God a high priest according to the order of Melchizedek (Hebrews).
tom in ga
ps: The Order of Melchizedek ... such a statement about an allusive and strange "shaman" of the Old Testament who appears out of know where to feed the father of our faith, Abraham, with a little bread and wine!
Date: 07 Apr 2000
Time: 20:08:53
Here is still more on Dietrich Bonhoeffer. I believe there is a wonderful connection between Jesus' "end of life" decision and Dietrich Bonhoeffer's. According to John Doberstein's intro. in my copy of "Life Together," friends urged DB (in 1939) to remain in the U.S. in what would amount to just about complete safety. Here he could have used his gifts among another people, among people who needed and appreciated him. Doberstein's comment is telling: "...he refused and boarded one of the last ships to return to his manifest destiny." As for Jesus in John's gospel, so for Bonhoeffer centuries later.
I am titling my sermon "Jesus' Manifest Destiny--and Ours." I will imagine that Phillip and Andrew's conversation with Jesus might have sounded much like that of DB's well-meaning friends with him in 1939. Both would have urged what they thought, honestly, were far better ways in the midst of urgent days. But Jesus knew that "the hour" had "come"--the ship was ready to set sail, if you will--and that, if he turned aside for very long, the opportunity would get past: just as DB, in following the way of Jesus centuries later knew there were fewer ships every day that would carry him home to his own destiny, whatever that meant, truly WHATEVER that meant. And just so there would be no mistake, Jesus reiterates: "unless a grain of wheat falls into the ground and dies" -- "when I am lifted up from the earth" (speaking of his death). But he also has, as did Bonhoeffer, through the gift of the Spirit and the witness of the Father, that clear-eyed vision of being swept up in something which, while far greater than himself nevertheless included himself. Was this time without its share of fear and trembling? Of course not. "Now my soul is troubled," Jesus says. Here is no bland, blind, unblinking, unthinking commitment to a "cause." Such commitment would not be enough to separate the likes of Jesus or Dietrich (or you or me, even) from any number of other revolutionaries: Caesar or Hitler or Timothy McVeigh or ... (fill in the blank).
One more striking thing to me is that, while much of John's gospel shows Jesus clearly in control of his emotions and his destiny, the sands are running quickly away through the hour-glass of decision. There is this "troubling in the soul" right now; and there will soon be abandonment to the Father's will after much prayer. Finally, all power (seemingly) will be stripped as Jesus is arrested, tried, and strung up. So it was for Bonhoeffer, that at some moment, real but unknown, the die would be cast, the outcome clear. Jesus knew (like Bonhoeffer later, and like so many others, too) that "there is a tide in the affairs of men" that must be taken, a ship for the motherland that must be boarded, a crisis of decision that must be grasped--not in order to gain or keep control, but to yield control to the Father and follow the way of the cross.
There is a difference between Jesus and Dietrich, however, that must also be noted. Without Jesus' decision to abandon the throne of his life for the sake of God's plan, Dietrich Bonhoeffer would never have had any decision to make at all. And neither would I. And neither would you. We follow where our Lord had led: after all, isn't that what it means to "walk" in "the light"--"believe in the light"--and "become children of light"?
Date: 07 Apr 2000
Time: 20:10:06
Here is still more on Dietrich Bonhoeffer. I believe there is a wonderful connection between Jesus' "end of life" decision and Dietrich Bonhoeffer's. According to John Doberstein's intro. in my copy of "Life Together," friends urged DB (in 1939) to remain in the U.S. in what would amount to just about complete safety. Here he could have used his gifts among another people, among people who needed and appreciated him. Doberstein's comment is telling: "...he refused and boarded one of the last ships to return to his manifest destiny." As for Jesus in John's gospel, so for Bonhoeffer centuries later.
I am titling my sermon "Jesus' Manifest Destiny--and Ours." I will imagine that Phillip and Andrew's conversation with Jesus might have sounded much like that of DB's well-meaning friends with him in 1939. Both would have urged what they thought, honestly, were far better ways in the midst of urgent days. But Jesus knew that "the hour" had "come"--the ship was ready to set sail, if you will--and that, if he turned aside for very long, the opportunity would get past: just as DB, in following the way of Jesus centuries later knew there were fewer ships every day that would carry him home to his own destiny, whatever that meant, truly WHATEVER that meant. And just so there would be no mistake, Jesus reiterates: "unless a grain of wheat falls into the ground and dies" -- "when I am lifted up from the earth" (speaking of his death). But he also has, as did Bonhoeffer, through the gift of the Spirit and the witness of the Father, that clear-eyed vision of being swept up in something which, while far greater than himself nevertheless included himself. Was this time without its share of fear and trembling? Of course not. "Now my soul is troubled," Jesus says. Here is no bland, blind, unblinking, unthinking commitment to a "cause." Such commitment would not be enough to separate the likes of Jesus or Dietrich (or you or me, even) from any number of other revolutionaries: Caesar or Hitler or Timothy McVeigh or ... (fill in the blank).
One more striking thing to me is that, while much of John's gospel shows Jesus clearly in control of his emotions and his destiny, the sands are running quickly away through the hour-glass of decision. There is this "troubling in the soul" right now; and there will soon be abandonment to the Father's will after much prayer. Finally, all power (seemingly) will be stripped as Jesus is arrested, tried, and strung up. So it was for Bonhoeffer, that at some moment, real but unknown, the die would be cast, the outcome clear. Jesus knew (like Bonhoeffer later, and like so many others, too) that "there is a tide in the affairs of men" that must be taken, a ship for the motherland that must be boarded, a crisis of decision that must be grasped--not in order to gain or keep control, but to yield control to the Father and follow the way of the cross.
There is a difference between Jesus and Dietrich, however, that must also be noted. Without Jesus' decision to abandon the throne of his life for the sake of God's plan, Dietrich Bonhoeffer would never have had any decision to make at all. And neither would I. And neither would you. We follow where our Lord had led: after all, isn't that what it means to "walk" in "the light"--"believe in the light"--and "become children of light"?
TK in OK
Date: 07 Apr 2000
Time: 21:08:28
Wondering ...... Does lifted up from the earth mean? Just, Christ being lifted up on the cross or could it also mean his resurrection? To have a resurrection one must truly die. For the Jews to see someone resurrected... as Christ was then something new has happened. Could this mean that all would we drawn to Him because of His body resurrection. I have no understand of NT Greek so I am asking other who may have more knowledge in these matters. Christ has died, Christ has risen, Christ will come again. Amen. MCinPA
Date: 08 Apr 2000
Time: 04:03:26
Is there any significance to Philip being from Bethsaida?
Why do we never again hear from the greeks (until Paul)?
Date: 08 Apr 2000
Time: 05:23:27
Lifted up HOW?
If I be lifted up....
lifted up by sinners on a cross, lifted up by the Father from a tomb, lifted up by Christians from dusty pages that He might be revealed in our flesh ...
THEN I will draw all people to me.
LIFT HIGH THE CROSS, THE LOVE OF CHRIST PROCLAIM TILL ALL THE WORLD ADORE HIS SACRED NAME.
Date: 08 Apr 2000
Time: 10:02:03
To Lifted up HOW. Thank you. You've put it all together. Now I have a sermon. Searching all week. Questions in my heart would not let me rest. Thanks be to God. MCinPA
Date: 08 Apr 2000
Time: 13:37:16
As I see it, it is somewhat difficult--being true to the storyline within John's gospel--to justify making "lifted up" to mean "resurrected." The other two connections with such language (John 3:14, 8:28) are a stretch, at best, to make into resurrection references; while here in 12:32-33 we are clearly told Jesus uses such an image "to indicate the KIND OF DEATH he was to DIE,"--namely, crucifixion, at the hands of religious and political authority, and at the behest of well-meaning but misguided common folks. Such an Easter interpretation by Easter people is certainly consistent with Easter faith, but we risk missing the profound depths of John's message by making a premature jump to resurrection.
When next week we arrive at Holy Week, we do not pretend Jesus is not raised (and thus that we are not Easter people) yet we do try to enter the entire drama of redemption, to embody that story in such a way that it names and claims us--a story which does not PRECLUDE death, but INCLUDES it. So John, who has been grasped by Easter-truth, still would have us take to heart martyr-faith. To do otherwise would be to miss the very road that leads to glory.
TK in OK
Date: 08 Apr 2000
Time: 13:55:34
Thanx to many(Jonathan, revup, GGinNC, and others)for informing and inspiring my still developing sermon. Here's a question for the scholars who know their greek and hebrew(I'm still in my 44th year of wrestling with english). I'm trying to decide if there is anything to the verb tenses in verses 31-32. Now IS the judgement; Now WILL BE the ruler of this world driven out; I WILL, when lifted, draw all to me. It seems to me that the driving and the drawing are yet to come(shortly) but NOW IS the judging, just as Jesus makes the decision to follow thru with the cross instead of the lesser glory of appealing to the Greeks. The point I want to make in my sermon is that as soon as we decide to follow God, Satan is dethroned. It may not seem like much at the moment, only distant thunder, but it changes the corse of all that follows, this moment of decision. There must of corse be follow-through. Jesus did have to go to the cross. But am I wrong to say that it wasn't the actual death on the cross, but the willing faithful decision of Jesus to do his father's will that saved me and glorified God? Iwant to say that God does not glory in the shedding of blood but in the faithfulness of His children to fully trust Him. Faith is the victory and the moment of decision is the undoing of this world's ruler. I may well go on and preach this anyway, but it would be nice to know if the scripture backs me or if again I have to ignore it to preach the "gospel according to tom". Love and peace, tom in TN(USA)
Date: 08 Apr 2000
Time: 19:17:50
To the one who asked the significance of Philip being from Bethsaida... Bethsaida was a town on the edge of Galilee, a cosmopolitan town where non-Jews also lived. (Philip and Andrew are also Greek names). The Greeks probably approached Philip because he would be more likely to sympathize with people who were not Jewish. Helpful? DG
Date: 08 Apr 2000
Time: 22:50:44
Most of you are long since finished with your sermons by now but not me. Struggle has been my watchword on this text. Reading through many of your comments leads me to "disillusionment" and "must see Jesus." to really see Jesus is to be dispossessed of your illusions. Much like he must have been on the eve of his crucifixion. Recently due to a combination of events I have been dispossessed of my adolescent illusion of immortality. Life has a begining and will have an end, even for Jesus. I in one sense have always known this and not known it. Yet without the full "cost" (of Discipleship) fully knowing it, "losing your life," what life in Christ means will not have occurred to me or others. jb in ga
Date: 09 Apr 2000
Time: 00:47:09
Sorry about the late hour of my submission. I wanted to say something about cheap grace. I don't believe in cheap grace. Grace is free or it isn't grace.
The cost of salvation is free. Being a disciple, or follower of Christ is another story. Being a disciple might be very costly. It may even cost us our lives.
Norskyswede
Date: 09 Apr 2000
Time: 03:27:10
To Norskyswede: AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!!! LDCinCa
Date: 09 Apr 2000
Time: 04:08:03
JB in GA: No, you're not alone. I'm still struggling too. Yet it seems to me that the struggle, the confusion, the ambiguity, truly do take us to the "inside" of Jesus's eyes. I think that's what He saw (i.e. what the gospel-writer wants us to see Him as seeing)--and that the point of all that is the consummation of the "became flesh" and the "dwelt among us" that the prologue proclaims (1:14). And we "behold His glory" when "The hour has come for the Son of Man to *be* glorified. Yet, that "hour" when He is glorified is the "now" when His soul is troubled. And His recognition and acknowledgement of the troubling of His soul prompt that remarkable interior dialogue that follows: "What should I say?" (Stop for a minute to ponder Our Savior, the Son of God, the Word made flesh uttering those words--"Ummmm, what should I say???") Does He *really* consider saying, "Father, save me from this hour"? Well, if He *doesn't*--why are they in the text!?! Then comes his "No" (and I hear in the background Karl Barth's "Nein"!). "For *this reason* I have come to this hour." Then recall that the word "hour" first appears in this passage as the "hour...for the Son of Man to be glorified." Not glory as in the approbation of the multitude that expands to include the Greeks, the approval rating that impresses even the Pharisees (v. 19, which is why I'm starting the lection at v. 17)--that is the glory of self-affirmation/control/success. No, His glory is submission--to the will of His Father and the cross that ensues? Of course--but first (and maybe more importantly for the issue of His fully becoming flesh and truly dwelling among us) submission to--the troubledness of His soul--the reason He came to this hour of His glorification, and, in fact, the substance of His glorification. Sermonic significance of the above? We as Xns are not called to "follow Jesus" as the always-totally-together Savior we are conditioned to salute, but as the "troubled soul" who "cried out with tears to His Father," and who "*learned* (Pause again to ponder Jesus "learning"--"Oh, I didn't know that!") obedience from what he suffered "[including/especially a troubled soul?]. If "we would see Jesus" that way, then our own troubled souls become less something to deny and hide and more a resource for ministry we might recognize as incarnational--and whose beneficiaries might recognize as Jesus. GG in NC