Date: 3/4/2003
Time: 10:47:27 AM
The scriptures have "rainbow" references early and late--this one (Gen. 9) and the one in Revelation where the "little angel" descends with a "scroll" (Rev. 9). I wonder what connections can be made?
TK in OK
Date: 3/4/2003
Time: 12:31:51 PM
I am stressing the covenant that God makes. Then I hope in a very short sermon to connect the Baptism & temptation passage with this one. Nancy Wi
Date: 3/5/2003
Time: 7:14:06 AM
With this text I'm thinking of emphasizing the covenant that God makes with all humanity and all of creation. The possibility of really starting over with a promise of reconciliation and restoration is too good to pass up. I've always gone with the text of Jesus in the wilderness, so this is a switch for me. This theme of restoration after destruction is a positive message. Craig in NY
Date: 3/5/2003
Time: 7:14:07 AM
With this text I'm thinking of emphasizing the covenant that God makes with all humanity and all of creation. The possibility of really starting over with a promise of reconciliation and restoration is too good to pass up. I've always gone with the text of Jesus in the wilderness, so this is a switch for me. This theme of restoration after destruction is a positive message. Craig in NY
Date: 3/5/2003
Time: 8:53:11 AM
I, too, am going with this reading and focusing on covenants. Here are some early ideas: -This covenant is with humans *and* animals--how often do we forget this? How would we live differently if we remember it? or: -God made a Covenant TO Humanity with Noah. God made a Covenant WITH Humanity with Abraham. God made a Covenant BY Humanity with Jesus. (Noah didn't have to do anything for his covenant. Abraham had to hold up his end of the covenant. And with Jesus, none of us could adequately hold up our end of the covenant--it's grace.)
Mamma Helen
Date: 3/5/2003
Time: 12:20:57 PM
I've read that, in the ancient Near East, mythology had it that a rainbow was the weapon of a god, and the lightning was the arrows shot from the bow. I'm playing with imagery, here -- perhaps God is laying the bow to rest, promising not to use it to wipe out creation again.
Also, we have a multi-media service. I may make use of the song from The Muppet Movie, "The Rainbow Connection," in which Kermit, the Frog, repeats the notion that "rainbows are visions, but only illusions," and then declares, "I know they're wrong! Wait and see!" Is it illusory to think that we can hang up the bow (weapons) that we use against the natural world? If we do, is that a repsonse to the covenant that God has made with all living creatures? Might that be a good place to start our self-evaluation at the beginning of Lent? MTSOfan
Date: 3/6/2003
Time: 4:44:30 AM
does anyone know the verses for the camp song about noah,it starts out "The Lord said to Noah there's gonna be a floody, floody, Lord said to Noah, there's gonna be a floody, floody, get those children's feet out of the muddy,muddy, children of the Lord.
thanks ks in ME
Date: 3/6/2003
Time: 6:53:34 AM
To ME:
Here it is "Arky, Arky" or "Rise and Shine"
(Chorus) Rise and shine and give God the glory-glory (x3)Children of our God.
God said to Noah, "There's gonna be a floody, floody" (x2) Get those children out of the muddy, muddy, Children of our God.
Noah, he built him, he built him an arky, arky (2X) Made it out of gopher barky, bary. Children of our God.
All of the animals, they came in by two-zies, two-zies (x2) Elephant and kangaroozies, roozies. Children of our God.
Rained and poured for fortyday-zies, dayzies (x2) Nearly drove those animals crazies, crazies. Children of our God.
Dove went out to take a peeky, peeky (x2)Dove came back with twig in her beaky, beaky. Children of our God.
This is the end of, the end of our story, story (x2) Everything is hunky-dory, dory. Children of our God.
Guitar choirs: C F C DM7 Enjoy Rev. WWM (Quebec
Date: 3/6/2003
Time: 8:25:42 AM
MTSOfan: I love the idea of God's laying aside the bow of the gods with the promise never to use it again against the creation! Thanks for that. CEinCO
Date: 3/6/2003
Time: 9:22:28 AM
MTSOfan I am using the Rainbow Connection and we have children dancing in and laying different colors on the rainbow. If you want I will share the prayers with you. revncarmichael@yahoo.com I also am printing the words in the bulletin with a little explaination! I find that helps my older population "hear" the words better. Nancy-Wi
Date: 3/6/2003
Time: 9:24:46 AM
opps, Kenny Logins has a very good recording. I envy (bad I know) your multi media ability. Nancy-Wi
Date: 3/6/2003
Time: 9:52:03 AM
I find this quote of interest.
Some scholars have suggested that it is reminiscent of the Spirit of God brooding over the waters (Gen. 1:2), but it is also reminiscent of the dove that comes bearing an olive branch following the flood, promising that salvation is near (Gen. 8). "The key element in this text is the descent of the Spirit, not the dove simile" (Donahue & Harrington, 65). The Covenant with Noah, depended upon humanity alone to keep it intact. The new covenant through Christ, depends on grace, freely given. Pondering, Nancy-Wi
Date: 3/6/2003
Time: 1:02:52 PM
To ME & WWM (Quebec: Don't forget this verse! - "The sun came out & dried up the landy landy (x2) then everything was fine and dandy dandy, children of God (Ilearned it, "children of the Lord") Ken in WV
Date: 3/6/2003
Time: 1:12:50 PM
There's also a verse about the animals they came off, they came off, they came off by threesie's, threesies, children of the Lord! EM
Date: 3/6/2003
Time: 4:58:46 PM
As to the Noah song, when they came off by threezies it was orangatangs and chimpanzeezies, just incase anyone wants to use it.
And there are motions to the chorus and verses, but it would take too much space to describe them, so use your imagination.
RevSophia, camp song leader of long ago!
Date: 3/6/2003
Time: 8:08:49 PM
The "threesies" is: "must have been those birds and beesies beesies."
I don't know what I'm preaching about yet (it seems to get later and later each week...), but I like the idea that the rainbow symbolizes God putting aside God's power. God has the power to destroy. But instead God sets up a covenant. And in Jesus, God puts aside God's power as well; we are brought to God by Christ's death, by the giving up of life, rather than cooercion.
DGinNYC
Date: 3/6/2003
Time: 8:43:45 PM
Thank you all for your Rise and Shine verses. It took a bit to jog my memory, but the Bible school movements etc came back. I am still not sure if I will use this with my children's sermon (altho what better response to God's promises to us than Rise and Shine).
ks in maine
Date: 3/7/2003
Time: 6:18:57 AM
Rainbows appear when the sun shines through the rain. It's raining somewhere, but the promise is: the sun is shining through...it won't be long now.
I find it interesting that there are no covenant stipulations here (like leave your family and go to the land...or the commandments/law given to Moses as a response to the Mosaic Covenant.) God chooses simply to be bound by God's word.
I have to admit the cynic in me says: "Okay fine, you won't destroy the earth through water, that eliminates one out of countless other ways like fire, radiation, etc." I just have to get over it I guess and focus on the positive side of this covenant.
John near Pitts.
Date: 3/7/2003
Time: 8:03:14 AM
I wonder if the building of the ark and following God's commandment was not the "covenant stipulation"? Nancy-Wi
Date: 3/7/2003
Time: 10:08:52 AM
My Sermon Topic is Covenant and commitment... 5 part sermon series for lenten season....God made covenant with Noah and sons...represents all of all , not just chosen people, hebrews...Covenant is a binding agreement or compact...law suit to recover damages, promise... when I think about that... God Loved the human so much He made a binding agreement in love to recover damages lost when the serpent stole them, when we allowed to be stolen...
Because of this covenant---God let's us choose---right---free will...
When we choose wisely, we commit to HIM. What does that really entail. To be consigned to place. a pledge... ARE we really CONSIGNED to GOD? (deep) Are we taking our pledge seriously?
We should.
Since,Noah God made covenant...Have you really understood the commitment? I leave you all with that/ Pastor mary in Ohio
Date: 3/7/2003
Time: 12:11:51 PM
Pastor Mary in OH- I appreciagte your points about commitment, but one thing -God made the covenant with ALL of life - all flesh - not just Noah (9:17). This is significant, representing a change in God's will - that mercy would outweigh wrath or rightful anger, which led God to bring the flood out of anguish over human behavior. THis is a great blessing on creation. It means that the covenant is not something we have earned or we deserve, but it is GOd's gracious perogative. And when we accept and live within it - what a wonderful life, eh? Jim in CT.
Date: 3/7/2003
Time: 2:14:20 PM
My sermon on this Bible verses will be "Starting all over again." Main content will be on baptism and its renewal.
Date: 3/8/2003
Time: 5:45:15 AM
This passage is pulling on me, also. In combination with the Psalm, and first Sunday of Lent, I'm thinking that it has something to say about current world conditions. I haven't actually started writing yet, except for my liturgy, and I want to share my Prayer of Confession, especially in response to the "cynicism" noted by John near Pitts. I hope that some of you may pray this prayer with me, and that the passage might call us all to an increased sense of WORLD community and GLOBAL thinking.
Janice in KS
Date: 3/8/2003
Time: 5:49:56 AM
PS Here's my Prayer of Confession:
Holy Covenant-Giving God, you have h ung YOUR bow in the clouds, and promised not to bring destruction. But we have made more and more bows, bigger and better, and we threaten ourselves with destruction. You established your promise for all the creatures of the earth, but we threaten whole species of creatures with extinction. You created a sign of your promise that does not know boundaries or race or economic status or ability or preference, but we divide ourselves into factions and struggle for control over each other. Forgive us. Forgive our world, forgive our nation, forgive our cities, forgive each one of us and the regrets that we now confess in silence . . .
Janice in KS
Date: 3/8/2003
Time: 7:48:23 AM
Thank you Janice in KS for the prayer. I will join you in it. DGinNYC
Date: 3/8/2003
Time: 9:32:36 AM
Janice:
I will add your prayer to my pastoral prayer (we don't use a prayer of confession). Thank you for your thoughtful words.
And by the way, it's elephants and chimpanzeezees zeezees (lots of fun to act out).
Thanks, all,
Pam in San Bernardino
Date: 3/8/2003
Time: 11:42:44 AM
hello all,
i am coming to this list late this week as i have been sick. but i have been captured by this lesson and it won't let go of me. i wanted to add a few notes.
Nancy-Wi: you write "The Covenant with Noah, depended upon humanity alone to keep it intact. The new covenant through Christ, depends on grace, freely given."
but there is nothing in the text which states or even implies any expectations of noah nor his descendants.
if you look at the text this covenant is different from other covenants in that they usually are between two parties which make promises about future behavior (sometimes with attendant curses) and oh heck, i can't remember #2.
but... in this covenant god is the only actor. nothing is expected or demanded of noah. he is not asked to respond in any way. and god states the covenant more than once, so it's not like the court stenographer got it down wrong the first time. also, as other people have pointed out, it is not just for israel (which didn't exist yet) or even all human kind, but all living beings.
and the bow is very interesting to me. as you said MTSOfan, the bow (not rainbow, but bow as in bow & arrows) is an instrument of war. god puts the bow aside. the other interesting thing is that the bow serves as a reminder, not for us, but for GOD. at least twice he says that when she sees it GOD will remember the promise.
thanks for the rainbow connection. that adds a light touch to a potentially heavy topic!
mb+ in ga
Date: 3/8/2003
Time: 3:11:46 PM
Just so ya'all know...the word in Hebrew for "bow" here actually does refer to a weapon, such as a bow and arrow. The implications of this are so great for us in this time...
This is the first covenant in the Bible, it is an unconditional covenant, God does not ask Noah -or anyone else for that matter- to do anything in return for this kindness, and God promises to lay down God's weapons an to not raise them again. If God can make the the very first covenant for us, then why can't humans figure out how to do the same?
Date: 3/8/2003
Time: 5:03:26 PM
A big "Amen" to the unsigned comment about laying down weapons! MTSOfan
Date: 3/8/2003
Time: 10:38:47 PM
Janice in KS,
I just found your prayer of confession... I will use same as my pastoral prayer...
It is WONDERFUL!
It's late, hope you see my "kudo",
pulpitt in ND
Date: 3/8/2003
Time: 11:10:14 PM
If you want to sing marathon lyrics to "Rise and Shine" (Arky, Arky), you cna find them at: http://www.kididdles.com/mouseum/r024.html
Peace, therevvv
Date: 3/9/2003
Time: 2:13:25 PM
Pulpitt in ND
Yes I saw your late "kudo." It's good to hear from you. I tried to send an e-mail, but it came back as undeliverable, so I'm guessing you've changed serversf or something. If you want to e-mail me with your correct address, I'll re-send what I wrote. I'm still JLGentle@aol.com
It's good to hear from you. And I loved the tealight idea!
Janice in KS